23.976 FPS Questions

[Fluxmeister]

I've been a 29.97 editor for a long time. (sure beats the 30fps I was doing at one point)

I've been looking into changing over to 23.976 fps and have had some luck encoding etc. There are a few things that I am wondering though... maybe those familiar with editing in 23.976 fps.

These are kind of big blobs of questions/ideas. I am hoping they aren't blatantly answered in the guides...

1) In premiere 6+ you have to convert the audio to a new rate. This requires the audio to be added in later... so lets say you edit like I do and haphazardly create introductions with various audio etc. (making your wav file pretty much variable until the final encode) Should I switch over to excess planning to avoid such problems? Or is there some decent work around so that you can get away with such an editing style? (look into an editor that actually does 23.976, and not 24?)

2) Some people have mentioned just skipping the whole audio conversion bit and just later changing the 24 fps (premiere export) whole avi (audio/video together) to 23.976... while this sounds appealing for the lazemeister it's also kind of risky sounding... Does anyone out there do this? Have you run into any issues? (especially as this can break sync a bit)

3) Big picture... does anyone have any method for working with 23.976 that really works well for you?

-----------------------
In general I've seen this as my plan for battle:

basic:

edit in 24fps with converted audio in premiere 6.5 -> export video, tweak with abcAVI tag editor -> vdub and add original wav

complex with intros and haphazardly added audio: (and a huge gaping hole of a problem maybe?)

convert all wavs and edit with 24 fps -> export video, tweak with abcavi tag editor -> "Magically build wav file that compiles all my audio files" -> vdub and add "magical wav file"

I've been wondering what approach to take for creating the magical wav file... put them in premiere @ 29.97 and try to find the exact spots where they were placed and export that? Edit each part seperately and use glue to hold it all together?

I appreciate the help in this "new world" of 23.976.

I think I need a big step by step check list haha...

Thanks!

[Scintilla]

You could convert the audio you're using for your intro too, then when you've got your exported video files, add the original WAVs using the AudioDub command, and string them together in AVISynth using an aligned splice.

Or, if that's not possible, export the audio for your intro as a WAV, then use AVISynth's ResampleAudio or AssumeFPS to get the audio to fit, then add the original WAV for the video proper and aligned splice...

... Or something like that...

[Zarxrax]

I know its wrong, but I usually just work in 23.98 fps. Then I can do some sort of framerate conversion later if need be. Typically this might mean something like 2-3 dropped or added frames... and I've sure as hell never been able to tell.
I'd just use a different editor that supports 23.976 fps though... well... if I could find one I liked, I would :\

[NicholasDWolfwood]

Really, AFAIK, the only editors that even let you use 23.976fps is Cinelerra and FCP. I dunno really if FCP even lets you do it. Cinelerra is GNU/Linux...

[Metro]

Vegas suports 23.976 fps

[bum]

Vegas suports 23.976 fps

yeah it also suports kicking premiers ugly grey arse

[benjamingeiger]

[quote=NicholasDWolfwood]Really, AFAIK, the only editors that even let you use 23.976fps is Cinelerra and FCP. I dunno really if FCP even lets you do it.[/quote]

Yes, FCP does allow you to use 23.976 FPS.

[Corran]

1) In premiere 6+ you have to convert the audio to a new rate. This requires the audio to be added in later... so lets say you edit like I do and haphazardly create introductions with various audio etc. (making your wav file pretty much variable until the final encode) Should I switch over to excess planning to avoid such problems? Or is there some decent work around so that you can get away with such an editing style? (look into an editor that actually does 23.976, and not 24?)

I make my intros separately and add them in after I get the audio back to the right rate. You can either do that or change the rate of the audio for your intro too.

[Fluxmeister]

So how does one glue together a bunch of 23.976 avi files...

avisource(file, file)
&
avisource(file) + avisource(file)

both just give me can't compress frame 0 errors...

note: each file does work fine on it's own... just any attempt to combine them = doom.

Thx!

[Fluxmeister]

To clarify:

avisource(file)

on just a single one of my files works fine.