'concept' videos |:>

JaddziaDax · Post by **JaddziaDax** » Thu May 24, 2007 5:40 pm

shaister wrote:
Koopiskeva wrote: Making effects videos, giving vague references, and people referring to them as 'art.'
Uh oh, now you have to define art!

well as far as that goes and how subjective "art" is just about every video on this site can be considered a type of "art" @_@

Koopiskeva · Post by **Koopiskeva** » Thu May 24, 2007 5:41 pm

shaister wrote:
Koopiskeva wrote: Making effects videos, giving vague references, and people referring to them as 'art.'
Uh oh, now you have to define art!

I think art is defined by a haruhi keychain being dangled in front of a camera while a guy hums a vaguely familiar song, and at the end, haruhi gets mauled by a stuffed pig.

I could be wrong, but I doubt it.

Yok/0 · Post by **Yok/0** » Thu May 24, 2007 5:42 pm

Koopiskeva wrote

Making effects videos, giving vague references, and people referring to them as 'art.'

Best of luck finding art around here. Amvs aren't exactly caligraphy afterall.

Graffiti is art...amvs..nah

shaister · Post by **shaister** » Thu May 24, 2007 5:44 pm

JaddziaDax wrote:
shaister wrote:
Koopiskeva wrote: Making effects videos, giving vague references, and people referring to them as 'art.'
Uh oh, now you have to define art!
well as far as that goes and how subjective "art" is just about every video on this site can be considered a type of "art" @_@

I think so too.

Phantasmagoriat · Post by **Phantasmagoriat** » Thu May 24, 2007 5:46 pm

Koopiskeva wrote:Perhaps I'm just not fond of the use of people using the word 'concept' to drive what many people are really doing. Making effects videos, giving vague references, and people referring to them as 'art.'

There's not a whole lot else that can be said... unless we start categorizing works... which has it's good and bad points. But to further our definitions a little anyways:

shaister wrote:I think there are ideas and emotions within the animation itself, completely separate from the story they are attached to in the anime.

yes and no. I think. If the lyrics to a song use the word 'willpower,' it would be fitting to show:
i.) a scene of a character struggling for their life. But at the same time,
ii.)a plain picture of a character like Kenshin... or better yet Naruto would work too...

as long as you have a vague understanding of the series [sry for teh example]. A lot of the time 'Classic' amvs play on the viewers previous knowledge of the anime [perhaps this is what appleals to you Koop?]. Pure concept videos have to work mainly with the first example... which imo is more difficult to do technically... probably why we see most 'concept' amvs as 'artsy.' But the second example has more personal impact. I think.

JaddziaDax · Post by **JaddziaDax** » Thu May 24, 2007 5:47 pm

i think that they seem artsy because they are in B&W and have that old timey film flicker...

shaister · Post by **shaister** » Thu May 24, 2007 5:53 pm

Phantasmagoriat wrote:If the lyrics to a song use the word 'willpower,' it would be fitting to show:
i.) a scene of a character struggling for their life. But at the same time,
ii.)a plain picture of a character like Kenshin... or better yet Naruto would work too...

Better still would be a scene of Kenshin or Naruto struggling for their life. I think the ideal AMV should be able to stand on its own without prior knowledge of the anime it was based on. But if familiarity with the source enhances the impact of the AMV, that's great.

Phantasmagoriat · Post by **Phantasmagoriat** » Thu May 24, 2007 6:00 pm

agreed, and I also think within that lies the difference between a 'concept' amv and a 'classic' amv-- is it stand alone, or do we need to be familiar with the anime? For some of us, that familiarity has more of an impact than anything else.

CrackTheSky · Post by **CrackTheSky** » Thu May 24, 2007 7:25 pm

Koopiskeva wrote:Cracky,

And a bunch of stuff about Euphoria.

Just wanted to clear this up - when I mentioned Euphoria, I didn't mean to classify Euphoria as one of the 'conceptual' videos in question; rather, I referred to it in the sense that it was a video that did something different and helped to evolve AMVs in general. I see conceptual videos as another avenue down which that same kind of evolution can be accomplished - obviously I'm in the minority in this type of thinking, but I see these videos in the sense that they're taking an artform (for lack of a better word - whether or not AMVs can be classified as art is something you guys can argue about) and doing something different with it. That's as far as I think they can help move AMVs forward; maybe it's not the most efficient way to advance the AMV medium, but it's doing more than your typical AMV will do.

And obviously there are other ways this can be accomplished. Videos like ZephyrStar's 'daydream', which uses original 3D animation, is another way to think of this evolution advancing. These conceptual videos are just one of several avenues, and yes I would agree that many videos labeled as 'conceptual' could probably also be classified as pretentious bullshit. But I think just as many are legit, and I do really like them in general.

Greggus1 · Post by **Greggus1** » Thu May 24, 2007 7:59 pm

Wow, just wrote 15 paragraphs. I'll post what makes sense here :

With a pure concept video like Vertigo, the anime was not chosen for the emotional connection. It was chosen simply because it contained clips that would match the concept of the creator. Yet that is an AMV, because it is anime set to music. Some say the same video could have been made with live-action, and thus is not an AMV. First, that argument can be made with more than concept videos. Take Douggie's "Yoko : Remaining Deep in The Ocean", for example. Tell me you can't see every scene in there replaced with live-action. Yet that AMV promotes the anime, has a story, and is very emotional. I could name others, but you get the point.

Second of all, with Silencio remade with live-action, you could make the SAME argument that it's not a movie either. If a concept can be executed in any media, then whatever media it is produced in, it belongs to. But in the end, only the pieces of art that could be made ONLY in that media will be remembered. I believe Skittles to be one of those, but I don't think Silencio is. These concept videos, though technically belonging to AMVs, are something else entirely : Experimental.

Whether you like this experimental genre is your choice, and probably mainly depends on 2 things : Your taste for style versus substance, and your taste for variety. When it comes to Crackers, I think he just likes the variety. But Ben, your videos aren't like that. Your latest made me think, and it moved me, and it made me want to watch the anime. Vids like Silencio don't possess any of those traits, and that's why I believe so many find them "incomplete".

On a different note now, I entirely agree with Orwell on the genres to explore. The thing with storytelling is, there is no bar. Amazing movies are made every year, inventing new riveting stories every time, and very importantly, using new directing techniques. Directing an AMV is of course completely different from directing a feature, but I think the org is finally going to start giving scene selection the spotlight in the future. And that is the way to grab balls.

CracktheSky wrote:And obviously there are other ways this can be accomplished. Videos like ZephyrStar's 'daydream', which uses original 3D animation, is another way to think of this evolution advancing. These conceptual videos are just one of several avenues, and yes I would agree that many videos labeled as 'conceptual' could probably also be classified as pretentious bullshit. But I think just as many are legit, and I do really like them in general.

Oh no you didn't. Silencio is an experiment. Enjoy it as much as you want, but it does not advance AMVs AT ALL. Maybe it advances your brain, or the world, but not the artform of AMVing. On the other hand, "daydream" is a masterpiece that shows AMVs cannot, MUST NOT disappear : It could not be made in any other media, at all. Not even close. And THAT is art.