Gundam Seed

older_gohan · Post by **older_gohan** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:58 pm

No please lets get into it. I enjoy a good debate.

Their characters are boring and not likable etc new types are stupid shut up about them the whole idea is retarded and Im glad seed dosent dwell on it at all.

First off it was only really the first series of gundam that dewlt on teh idea of new types. Although you see it more often around Zeta and Chars counter attack. The characters are a lot more likeable, it just requires more than five braincells and five minutes to figure out what the character is like. I wont argue that seed was decent, but I haven't heard so much b***ing and whinning since I went to kindergarten. The kids are ignorant and have no sense of humanity or the ideas of war . (Which is evident from the useless banter that happens between most of them.) The show (like wing) is bent around a handfull of pilots that have these great gundam units which can save the whole universe. Each side does have their own but it's so bent around them it's almost sickening. After the first few eps I wanted to see some of those pilots die right away.

One more thing the earlier U.C. has over Wing and seed. Important characters can die within the first few episodes. Granted at the end of Seed, a few of those pilots die but again it didn't happen soon enough. Deaths of certain main characters help propel a story line.

The characters in seed are portrayed so much more realistically and the artwork is far better ack

Quick reminder for you, Mobile Suit Gundam was made in the 80's. The animation wasn't quite as good then as it is now. Yes Seed has some great animation but it still pales in comparison to the animation you see in 08th MS Team.

I think seed is awesome and I can't wait for another season. Kira and Hero yui could kick any of those whiney wussies in uc gundams ass with thier arms tied behind there back.

Another thing. Don't ever say that to any real fan of Gundam. Amuro ray is and will always be the best pilot gundam has ever seen. He may not have the great mech you see in Seed, but his piloting skills are far beyond any of theirs.

Also some of the pilots you see in some of the U.C. series aren't supposed to be amazingly great. Once again I'll pull from 08th MS team. Shiro Amada was not the best pilot. He lost a few MS's and almost got killed (a lot of times). However he wasn't supposed to be this amazing pilot either. He was supposed to be good enough to land as a unit leader and nothing more. He killed his share but in terms of the common soilder he did his duty.

Another thing to consider is the purpose behind what the show is trying to display. The series might not always be trying to say they had this awsome pilot. There is always plot twists.

To keep this on topic. I did enjoy Seed for what it was. Some interesting characters (A few I could do without). All in all it was a interesting addition to the U.C. era.

Mroni · Post by **Mroni** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 6:45 am

older_gohan wrote:No please lets get into it. I enjoy a good debate.
Their characters are boring and not likable etc new types are stupid shut up about them the whole idea is retarded and Im glad seed dosent dwell on it at all.
First off it was only really the first series of gundam that dewlt on teh idea of new types. Although you see it more often around Zeta and Chars counter attack. The characters are a lot more likeable, it just requires more than five braincells and five minutes to figure out what the character is like. I wont argue that seed was decent, but I haven't heard so much b***ing and whinning since I went to kindergarten. The kids are ignorant and have no sense of humanity or the ideas of war . (Which is evident from the useless banter that happens between most of them.) The show (like wing) is bent around a handfull of pilots that have these great gundam units which can save the whole universe. Each side does have their own but it's so bent around them it's almost sickening. After the first few eps I wanted to see some of those pilots die right away.

start me here
I never pay attention to useless banter. There was alot of substance to what was being said in gundam seed. The only halfway decent character in zeta gundam was the zeon lady can't remember her name it's not really important that particular gundam uc arc sucked badly. As for people dying in the first part of the series you have a whole ship full of guys die in the first ep. Then you have athruns freind. Nichol dies in the middle of the series not at the end also tal. As for great gundam units Zeta gundam had named units and zeta gundam itself used stupid newtype spiritual energy to become invincible to weapons which just threw that gundam farther in the toilet.
back to you
Quick reminder for you, Mobile Suit Gundam was made in the 80's. The animation wasn't quite as good then as it is now. Yes Seed has some great animation but it still pales in comparison to the animation you see in 08th MS Team.

I know when Gundam was made the original gundam may have an excuse for bad artwork zeta gundam does not. Correct me if Im wrong but Gundam 0083 is older than zeta and it has far better artwork. I agree that ms 08th has better art work than Gundam seed for the most part the chicks are not as hot though and it has the exact same artwork as gundam wing. I often say the artwork that came out of the 90s was the best because the shows had bigger budgets and computer animation wasnt widely used like it is now. Saying a show from the 80s has to have bad artwork is retarded though Bambi was from the 50s and the artwork in that is awesome. thats all got to do with money not technology.

I guess must not be a real fan of gundam I went out and spent 140 bucks on the zeta gundam box set I have all of wing seed and the original movies and ms 08th team. I liked ms 08th team until the ending which just blew chunks it turned into like apocolypse gundam or something. Amuro was a good character for 79 hes out of date today and hes not as good as pilot as heero or kira i'm sorry. All that said I have never been so emotionally effected by the other series as I have been by seed.

Mr Oni

older_gohan · Post by **older_gohan** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 11:33 am

Formatting can be a major b****.

Saying a show from the 80s has to have bad artwork is retarded though Bambi was from the 50s and the artwork in that is awesome. thats all got to do with money not technology

Start from there. Then address other points. Yes animation in the 80's was bad and it was because of the time it was made. Budget had really nothing to do with it. Although I am sure it played a part in make a show extensive. Each generation has a form of animation that is rather popular for it's time. In the 80's shows like Gundam and Macross had the kind of animation that was big. it was at the time it was made. Of course at that time the animation was completely amazing and revolutionary.

I agree that ms 08th has better art work than Gundam seed for the most part the chicks are not as hot though and it has the exact same artwork as gundam wing.

Why do the girls have to be majorly hot all the time? This is why I despise seed sometimes. The have a girl that is not overly good looking or is hot helps capture the reality the show is supposed to have. This is what mkakes it more appealing. That is why seed is not realistic. Because the characters are all 'Beautiful' which is not the case in the real world. In that sense Gundam Seed is not realstic to the story.

Also using Bambi as a crutch never works. The Animation in movies will (For the most part) always be better than the series.

I guess must not be a real fan of gundam I went out and spent 140 bucks on the zeta gundam box set I have all of wing seed and the original movies and ms 08th team. I liked ms 08th team until the ending which just blew chunks it turned into like apocolypse gundam or something.

Ok first off that in no way determines your fandom as a Gundam fan. Anyone could go out, buy the series and watch them. Knowledge is just as important as having them. Also you need to realize that Mobile Suit Gundam, 08th, (I'll stretch and add in 0080 and 0083) set the standard and story lines for Zeta and Seed. (Zeta I don't like as much either. It's like the Macross 2 of Gundam.) Once again we get into the realism behind Mobile Suit Gundam and the other Earlier chronologically set series. Mobile Suit gundam stated the fact that half of humanities death upon the start of the war. Thanks to nuclear weapons. Also the pilots relied purely upon skill to beat enemies. As well the mobile sutis were like any other. (Of course Amuro had gundam but it wasn't all powerfull and virtually indestructible. it could be destroyed by a normal Zaku if they got on good hit in.) Seed once more dwells on the idea that wing wanted and G Gundam loved. All powerful suits that could only be destroyed by a suit equally as powerful or more powerful. Also if you want to get into piloting skill, Amuro ray is the best pilot who has ever lived. He could fight and when given the chance to have a equally match gundam as they do. Heck i could get information from all you want on the two pilots and make a realistic fight between him and your favorite pilot, being totally objective and see who wins.
By the way my favorite pilot isn't Amuro. I liked Shiro Amada from 08th. He was freakin cool.

One last thing, every series after Mobile Suit Gundam has mimicked teh story line in one way or another. Yet another reason that causes the others to be not so original. The only one I would disagree being unoriginal is 08th ms team. The end was a little different althought some aspects stilla rised. Yes 0080, 0083, Zeta, and Seed based their off of Mobile Suit Gundam's general plot.

Heero_Yuy84 · Post by **Heero_Yuy84** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:55 pm

older_gohan wrote:Why do the girls have to be majorly hot all the time? This is why I despise seed sometimes. The have a girl that is not overly good looking or is hot helps capture the reality the show is supposed to have. This is what mkakes it more appealing. That is why seed is not realistic. Because the characters are all 'Beautiful' which is not the case in the real world. In that sense Gundam Seed is not realstic to the story.

If I had a dollar for everyone who's used that as a justification for Wing or SEED being better than the earlier titles I would be a VERY wealthy bastard. Ironically, I saw it as the failing point in both cases (it's not even just the women, EVERYONE's pretty...unless they're an older command person, in which case, more often than not, they're just there to die.)
Part of why I have a hard time buying SEED as realistic, actually...between the character designs, the ornate mecha, and the sharp art, everything just winds up looking plastic and artificial.

Yes 0080, 0083, Zeta, and Seed based their off of Mobile Suit Gundam's general plot.

0080 and 0083 are kind of stretching it there. Outside of the prototype Gundams, and, in 0080's case, construction in a Neutral colony, do they really have much else going for them in terms of borrowing from the storyline?

Kind of like suggesting Heavy Metal L-Gaim borrowed Star Wars's storyline simply because Daba & co. use what are effectively lightsabers.

Mroni · Post by **Mroni** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 10:46 pm

This is annoying ms 08th team sucked the ending was horrible it ruined the series. Even in the original gundam they rely too much on thier newtype abilitys which makes them better than anybody else in the cockpit. The characters and the plot of gundam seed borrow alot but do it better the very essence of the plot being more realistic than previous gundam series is what sets it apart the portrayal of emotions I don't care if the guy is a pretty boy if he has something intelligent to say and his emotions are believable. I prefer Turn A gundam over the previous stuff note that also please. Once again about the artwork in the 80s as I pointed 0083 is from the early 80s and it has way better artwork than zeta or robotech(which is from 78) which leads me to conclude that budget was a major factor in the tv shows in japan at the time. When it comes down to it I hate magical powers etc technology is the only power in my book not mind power crap. I cried watching seed it affected me none of the previous series have done that it's a better anime in my opinion and in the end thats all there is to this. Lacus being hotter is an important thing btw one of the reasons I watch anime is hot little do babies and lacus though a little old is plenty wackable.

Mr Oni

older_gohan · Post by **older_gohan** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 11:25 pm

First off, Macross was 1982. The second thing to remember is that most of the things the characters are talking about are ideas which were first presented in Mobile Suit Gundam. Like I said before, major plot ideas, characters, and even dialouge was formed from mobile suit gundam. Everything is based around that. Mobile Suit Gundam is the original in any gundam series idea you will see. The dialouge is virtually the same (Except of course you have to change things for the sake of different sides and characters).

Your still failing to understand that mobile suit gundam is the original idea behind all of these animes. Without mobile suit gundam you wouldn't have at least half the plot that it displays. You wouldn't have half the character conflicts that take place. Seed has not displayed anything extra ordinary that Mobile Suit Gundam or 08th hasn't presented before. It only took it and twisted it to fit the series.

Also here's the years the earlier series were created.

1979-1980 Mobile Suit Gundam
1985-1986 Gundam Zeta
1986-1987 ZZ
1988 Char's Counterattack
1989 Gundam 0080 (Big jump in years)
1991 Gundam 0083 (Explains why the animation is similar)
1991 Gundam F-91
1993-1994 Victory Gundam
1994-1995 G Gundam
1995-1996 Gundam Wing
1996 Gundam X
1996 08th MS Team
1999 Turn A Gundam
2003-2003 Gundam Seed
2004 Gundam Seed Destiny

There's your time line for the gundam series. You can see where the animation fits in with the timeline itself.

Mroni · Post by **Mroni** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:29 am

The thing i'm amazed im wrong on is macross I thought that was 78. I still dont believe you about the plot ideas being stolen. Do you mean between all the gundam series there are some plot similarities? That always happens colony drops etc. The way the characters and emotions are handled in seed is alot more realistic than in any previous gundam than say wing.

Mr Oni

older_gohan · Post by **older_gohan** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 7:17 am

Don't worry about being wrong with Macross. I have a slight obssession with the anime. I have every concievable OVA and series associated with macross. Not to mention I normally participate in Macross RP's and such, I have started a few fan clubs. Eh it's pitiful.

Honestly most of the plot and dialouge does come from Mobile suit gundam. Although each series will have a unique twist to it at one point. Some will throw a new light on it. I have to admitt Seed threw out a few new lights on the old ideas making for some rather impressive plot lines that developed. I'm not saying Seed was horrible. Wing was horrible, also G Gundam was a travesty as well. I'm just saying with the U.C. series that all have very similar ideas behind them. Each series has their own little quirks to them. Seed had the most unique out of any of the series.

I liked Seed, the characters were very unlikeable to me though.

Yes the emotion in Wing was like watching five year olds perform shakespere.

Mroni · Post by **Mroni** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 9:24 pm

And we learned from this that we like what we like. I personally want the next gundam series to have 8 year old girls as the pilots.

Mr Oni

older_gohan · Post by **older_gohan** » Tue Oct 11, 2005 9:38 pm

Lmao, that's mean. I would like to see it like a normal war one. With main characterrs actually dieing on a regular basis. You know, like war really is.