Evangelion Episode 23 Director's Cut proves the following...

[Cyanna]

I could have sworn that Units 00 and 02 were made from Adam.

It is impossible for the EVAs to have been made from Adam, based on the series continuity.

How?

Seriously. I am curious because the dialogue points otherwise.

[UncleMilo]

I could have sworn that Units 00 and 02 were made from Adam.

It is impossible for the EVAs to have been made from Adam, based on the series continuity.

How?

Seriously. I am curious because the dialogue points otherwise.

There are many translations of EVA and many of them have errors...

I mean "Lance of Longinus" is a minor mis-translation and it was in the ADV release of Evangelion. The "Spear of Longinus" is an actual Holy Relic and should not have been mis-translated... This shows a lack of research on the part of the translation.

Anyway...

It was established in the TV series that NERV was built where Lillith was. NERV has always had Lillith available to them for genetic copy.

Adam caused 2nd Impact and they indiated it had only regenerated so far (the Embryo that Kaji had with him) and that Adam's containment is why it had not regnerated further.

NERV never had Adam to work with (as far as taking genetic samples from) as far as I can tell from all I have read and seen.

Lastly, as I mentioned before, the EVAs are based on the descriptions of the demon children of Lillith.

-Uncle Milo

[HeartbreakerByZep]

You definetly make a convincing argument. But clearly the dialouge proves beyond a doubt otherwise, unless you can disccredit Kaworu and Seele. (Them being probably the most reliable sources of information in the series..) Something as simple as mistranslations can't be blamed and used to explain away the clear dialouge. I'd say the dialouge is one of the most important parts of understanding Evangelion. You certainly can't just look to mythology for the answers, Evangelion uses mythological refferences but it does not align with them. (In Evangelion) The Spear of Longinus was never used to pierce Christ. (In Evangelion) Adam did not give birth to humanity, Adam was not human. (In The Bible) Lilith did not give birth to Humanity. The refferences that are a part of Evangelion are not in any way Biblicly or mythologically accurate, and therefore you can't use mythology as basis of prove for anything in the series.

About Adam being not available and Lilith being available. That's a good point. But it's possible that Adam was brought to Nerv and used for Evangelion 00 (and previous prototypes), then moved to German for protection because of the large possibility of failure upon the arrival of the first angel (since for one thing they only have on pilot, and she's sometimes injured, and since they've never fought an angel before, or had an Evangelion in battle, they have no idea what level of effectiveness they will have, so it's safer to get Adam out of Tokyo-3 so that even if they fail there is still some chance) and then sampled in Germany to create Evangelion 02, and brought back to Nerv when the third pilot arrives and the time draws ever closer that Adam will need to be used.

[UncleMilo]

About Adam being not available and Lilith being available. That's a good point. But it's possible that Adam was brought to Nerv and used for Evangelion 00 (and previous prototypes), then moved to German for protection because of the large possibility of failure upon the arrival of the first angel (since for one thing they only have on pilot, and she's sometimes injured, and since they've never fought an angel before, or had an Evangelion in battle, they have no idea what level of effectiveness they will have, so it's safer to get Adam out of Tokyo-3 so that even if they fail there is still some chance) and then sampled in Germany to create Evangelion 02, and brought back to Nerv when the third pilot arrives and the time draws ever closer that Adam will need to be used.

What dialogue are you talking about? Because nothing I have seen in Evangelion supports anything you're saying. Furthermore, you're now jumping to unsupported ideas about how MAYBE they did this and MAYBE they did that.

And how can you BEGIN to hope to understand the surface story of Evangelion if you don't know the mythologies that are used in the story?

I mean, the seven-eye symbol isn't just something they thought was cool... it is the actual symbol of Lilith. The Angels are all designed in relation to the Angels that they are based on.

And let's not forget about Gendo's rug.

However, let's talk more about facts from the show. As far as I can tell from what I saw in the actual TV series, they had already found Lilith and built NERV around the location where Lilth was. Adam blew up and people knew this would happen as soon as man tampered with it. They knew this, which allowed Gendo to get out of the way long before it happened.

What makes more sense... that they could make use of Lilith, who they had on hand and under control... or that they were able to make copies from the genetic material from a blown up being that had to regenerate.

Misato made the mistake of believing that Lilith was Adam. They planned to deceive the audience by showing us this scene. Not only did it show how Misato was not "in the know" but it kept us confused.

Furthermore... the construction of EVA was being done in many countries under the coordination of NERV... (including the USA)

NERV had Lilith, not Adam.

-Uncle Milo

[HeartbreakerByZep]

The Eva series was born from Adam, born from man's antithesis. And yet the Lilim will utilise that which they hate most of all in order to survive. I do not understand.

...

Your Evas and I are composed of the same matter. Born from Adam, I can synchronise with it easily as long as there is no dominate soul. And Unit Two's soul is now hiding itself, thus Eva Two is mine.

The promised time has come. With the Lance of Longinus now lost, complementation using Lilith is impossible. Our only hope is to proceed with EVA-01, Lilith's sole clone.

If you're not willing to beleive the series, who are you going to beleive? Kaworu and Seele are easily among the most knowledgable people in the series. There's no point to deceive us or anyone else with these phrases, Kaworu's words are the ones that are suposed to make us realize the truth. If we can't even trust that these instances are reliable, there is almost nothing in Evangelion that we can beleive.

I have a fairly good grasp on all of the major mythology used for Evangelion. It has importance, but not really a lot of relevance. Like I said, what is used in Evangelion is not accurate at all to the original sources, so you can't expect other uses of mythology to be parallel while the clearest ones are not. The 7 Eye symbol was used countless times in the Bible, I'd be willing to bet that it doesn't have any overarching importance in Evangelion though, atleast as far as deciding on how the Evangelions where created is concerned.

About "MAYBE this... MAYBE that.." that's what Evangelion related theory is based on. Evangelion itself doesn't provide us with all of the answers in a clear cut "This is it. period." fashion, though all the information we need is right there, we just have to put two and two together to get it out. One has to see Point A and Point C and assume the most logical path between them would be point B. It's always open to interpretation and new thoughts, but whatever 'maybes' are the most logical and are backed the most by proves from the series are the ones that are accepted. It's a necissary thing.

[UncleMilo]

The Eva series was born from Adam, born from man's antithesis. And yet the Lilim will utilise that which they hate most of all in order to survive. I do not understand.

...

Your Evas and I are composed of the same matter. Born from Adam, I can synchronise with it easily as long as there is no dominate soul. And Unit Two's soul is now hiding itself, thus Eva Two is mine.

The promised time has come. With the Lance of Longinus now lost, complementation using Lilith is impossible. Our only hope is to proceed with EVA-01, Lilith's sole clone.

If you're not willing to beleive the series, who are you going to beleive? Kaworu and Seele are easily among the most knowledgable people in the series. There's no point to deceive us or anyone else with these phrases, Kaworu's words are the ones that are suposed to make us realize the truth. If we can't even trust that these instances are reliable, there is almost nothing in Evangelion that we can beleive.

I have a fairly good grasp on all of the major mythology used for Evangelion. It has importance, but not really a lot of relevance. Like I said, what is used in Evangelion is not accurate at all to the original sources, so you can't expect other uses of mythology to be parallel while the clearest ones are not. The 7 Eye symbol was used countless times in the Bible, I'd be willing to bet that it doesn't have any overarching importance in Evangelion though, atleast as far as deciding on how the Evangelions where created is concerned.

About "MAYBE this... MAYBE that.." that's what Evangelion related theory is based on. Evangelion itself doesn't provide us with all of the answers in a clear cut "This is it. period." fashion, though all the information we need is right there, we just have to put two and two together to get it out. One has to see Point A and Point C and assume the most logical path between them would be point B. It's always open to interpretation and new thoughts, but whatever 'maybes' are the most logical and are backed the most by proves from the series are the ones that are accepted. It's a necissary thing.

First: Where are those quoptes from? I have a feeling they are mistranslations of the series. I trust the series, but I already get the feeling that this is a weak translation of dialogue... probably mistranslated. The very fact that the line "Lance of Longinus" is part of the dialogue makes me very suspicious of it.

Second: That particular symbol on Lilith is specific to Lilith. I got this information from a guy who has been studying the Khaballa for a little over eight years (and who served as part of the team to translate the End of Evangelion movie). I trust his information a hell of a lot more than yours. Furthermore, I was not saying that information about the mythic sources for Evangelion were directly related to how the EVAs were created, but having KNOWLEDGE on the subject might open some doors to some of the questions of the series.

Third: Yes, EVA has many questions that require you to pay attention to plot points. I am suggesting, however, that if you play too fast and loose with that idea, you could just say anything and pretend you can justify it. You wrote this absurd proposal that people were just running around with Adam so they could get the genetic material they needed to make EVAs in Japan, Germany and the USA... but when they first tried to deal with Adam, he blew up. I think your theory is unfounded and your information highly questionable. You have said nothing to convince me that you're probably just using second hand information you got from some uninformed web-site. In the show, they made it clear that the EVAs were gentic copies from an Angel, but that they made use of computer brains just like the computer brains that make up the MAGI. What Gendo was hiding from SEELE was that EVA 01 was MORE than a copy... that it didn't have a human imprint, but the actual soul of Yui inside it. This is what made unit 01 special... it contained Yui's soul. (She was turned into LCL fluid and absorbed into it... which is all backed up by the facts in the show). The other EVAs merely had the imprints of personality just as the MAGI computer did.

Your argument does not convince me, but because this argument has even come up, I am going to confer over the weekend with some friends of mine who have a direct involvement with the series and see if I can get some information to back up your statements or not. If I'm wrong, I'll be the first one to admit it, but right now, I don't see enough to convince me I am.

-Uncle Milo

[Cyanna]

Kaworu's is from Episode 24 as he is decending into Terminal Dogma.

Keel's is from the first part of End of Eva.

[HeartbreakerByZep]

I don't care who's information you choose to beleive. I've read the Bible, and I know the significance of the #7. You're pitifully mistaken if you think I go around getting information from websites. I admit that I don't have 1/8th the knowledge or contemplation under my belt regarding Evangelion that a lot of people do, I simply work with what I know and if I'm wrong I'm wrong. Frankly, in my opinion you're relying too much on irrelevant factors - how Lance of Longinus is translated, or who information about Evangelion comes from, that doesn't matter, the latter less so than the former. Just because someone worked on the series doesn't mean they know anything about the series that the average profound Evangelion thinker doesn't know. There's really nothing about someone who worked on the series that gives them the edge, unless they where told things by Anno or while working on the series that hasn't been otherwise documented.

[Tab.]

You wrote this absurd proposal that people were just running around with Adam so they could get the genetic material they needed to make EVAs in Japan, Germany and the USA... but when they first tried to deal with Adam, he blew up.

Try again. I'm surprised, as much as you know of the series, that you missed the part about second impact being intentional. Furthermore, how do you think they recovered Adam, if they hadn't instead had him and 'been running around with him' the whole time? Read back a few pages, his recovery was impossible. Seele and Nerv have had him and his genes from square one.

[the Black Monarch]

If the first Rei didnt die, why would they have ANOTHER walking around, if the second Rei didnt die then why would they have a THIRD walking around. I guess im just not following u at all

Apparently you're not, because the bottom line here is that there NEVER WAS more than one Rei walking around.

First off, Lillith was discovered long before second impact, possibly inside the geofront.

Adam = first angel. Ergo Adam's discovery = before Lillith's discovery. Adam's discovery != long before second impact. Ergo Lillith's discovery != long before second impact.

Second, the Adam embryo was taken with Gendo and his crew when they left Antarctica a day before second impact.

Giant of Light = present for Second Impact. Giant of Light = Adam. Ergo Adam = present for Second impact. Ergo Adam != taken with Gendo and his crew when they left Antarctica a day before second impact.

About the Rei thing.....there is definatley at least 3 Reis (or more preceisly, 3 Rei bodies..) I distinctly remember seeingin an ep, during the half time thing, that it said Rei III.

Original Japanese episode title. It's the third episode that's about Rei. Go figure.

Maybe, they have a method for growth acceleration? That would explain the 4 year old Rei being create after Yui died...

Notice how all of the pilots are actually 14 years old, and not just well-developed 10- to 13-year-olds. Simply looking 14 isn't enough for Eva-piloting purposes, you have to actually be a specific age.

it's likely that Eva0 has Akagi Naoko in it.

No it's not.

But what about Eva3 and Eva4, and possilby Eva5 -Eva13?

Unit 03: Probably Toji's mom, though some suspect his sister... the core was "prepared" in time, meaning it wasn't soulless.

Unit 04: The guinea pig for an S2 engine would not require a soul, or maybe just not the soul of anyone we care about.

MPEs: I dunno, maybe they just picked 9 random people off the street. Who cares?

Seriuosly, like someone said before, it's possible that even the creators don't know.........

AMEN.

Rei, who was created and has no biological mother

Ritsuko says Rei was born. Being born kind of requires a mother.

I think its safe to asume Naoko soul is inside Unit 00

No it's not.

And even though Asuka's mom was driven insane because of the Eva....she didn't die from it. She hung herself. How did her soul get into Eva-02 then?

Body + soul = sane person
Body - soul = insane person

Get it?

Also, it is said that every single bit of life, down to the molecular level, was destroyed in SI.

Actually, no, that was never said. And even if it was said, it can't be true, because young Ms. Katsuragi survived.

Also I don't think Rei merging with Lillith is what caused the 3I, I think it was also the combination of her pulling Adam into herself before doing it. Remember Gendo shoving his hand into her heart, same hand that had Adam in it.

It also seemed to require The Mass-Produced Evas, the Lance of Longinus, the imitation Lances, and a number of very painful things being done to Unit 01 by the Mass-Produced Evas with the imitation Lances.

its stated that Unit 01 is diferent tto 00 and 02, in the fact that it was made of lilith (somewhere in eva.......)

Actually, no, that was also never stated... put down the crack pipe dude...

SPOILERS

I think we've LONG ago passed the part where spoiler tags are helpful...

but all the EVAs were made from Lillith...

The reason Unit 01 was different from Units 00 and 02 was because Units 00 and 02 had computer brains (which used the same technology as the MAGI computers... brain-like computers that made use of human imprint), but EVA 01 had the actual essence of Yui within it... making it more than a human imprint on a computer.

Dude, put down the crack pipe and watch the series again... they never said or implied anything like that, either. It IS, however, said/implied that the evas are based on Adam (something about resurrecting a god that they found in the antarctic... i.e. Adam)

I mean "Lance of Longinus" is a minor mis-translation and it was in the ADV release of Evangelion. The "Spear of Longinus" is an actual Holy Relic and should not have been mis-translated... This shows a lack of research on the part of the translation.

Lance = spear. Ergo Lance of Longinus = Spear of Longinus. Ergo mistranslation = nonexistent.

It was established in the TV series that NERV was built where Lillith was.

Umm... no it wasn't... it's possible, but it wasn't even suggested, much less "established."