McDirty wrote:Emong wrote:we see that the anti-SOPA movement was also effectively an anti-capitalist movement.
I disagree with you on this. I can see your point on having the common virtual culture be at danger in exchange for corporate interests, but it's not necessarily the main reason a lot of people and groups are against it. SOPA and PIPA also eliminates innovation with independent creators and can limit business competition on the internet. How are independent filmmakers, third-party programmers, and even small businesses going to grow, when people at the top of the corporate field are using the feds to shut them down (or at least limit their voice)? A good number of businesses and entrepreneurs are also anti-sopa.
Please pay attention to the precise formulation: "...was also
effectively an anti-capitalist movement..." This means they stood for a lot of the same causes as anti-capitalists even if they didn't use the same terms. I don't have any problems with anti-capitalism.
Chained(E)Studio wrote:However, Zeitgeist and the Venus Project are really strong on making sustainability for our future. That's what important to me. Knowing that future generations will continue to have the things we have. Our resources will run out period. It doesn't matter if we cut back, we can only dig so deep and use up whats there. It doesn't grow on trees and we can't replant it. Once its gone, its gone. Whether our governments around the world really take a serious step towards this, or we fight for it ourselves; I'm for that. I'd rather work the rest of my life building a future others in next 100 years can live in. Then just use everything up and say "suckers."
Offtopic for the win
All I know about Zeitgeist is the Moving Forward documentary so maybe my opinions are biased. They share a lot of the same premises as I do: capitalism is an inherently contradictory system, which is incompatible with ecology. I wouldn't even criticize them for their "crazy utopian visions" like some others seem to be doing. However there was one thing, which particularly struck me: their anti-political message. I think the documentary mistook corrupted liberal-democratic parliamentary politics for politics proper, which might be defined as collective struggles to pursue particular goals. If you cut out politics, you also cut out people's option of resistance. We have a name for it and it's called oppression
I guess if we decide the continue this convo it should be done via pm
