English in non-English anime

UncleMilo · Post by **UncleMilo** » Fri Aug 23, 2002 9:04 pm

I am very biased against Hollywood.

Of course... I feel that movies set in England (like Shakespere in Love) don't count in the comment I made.

Nor am I counting movies from other countries brought to US through Miramax

and I'm ignoring indie films.

However, Schindler's List is a very good point, with one exception... the cast includes big name actors playing the main roles. Liam Neeson, Ben Kingsley, and Ralph Fiennes are not from Poland or Germany.

In Enemy at the Gates, Ralph Fines and Bob Hoskins are not Russian and Ed Harris is not German.

Imagine if Hollywood made Enenmy at the Gates with ONLY RUSSIAN and GERMAN actors?

That was what I was getting at...

-Uncle Milo

SarahtheBoring · Post by **SarahtheBoring** » Sat Aug 24, 2002 11:53 am

Whoa, whoa, wait a second. So you get to factor in ALL of anime, including those set outside Japan, but you're factoring out over half of the American movie industry PLUS movies set in England - and you claim not only that this is a fair comparison, but think that it's fair to bash <i>all of American culture</i> with that comparison?

I cry foul. Those are not equal parameters.

If you have your own personal vendetta against American culture or fetish for Japanese culture, then that's your own business. But don't pretend that they are rational or fair comparisons.

LongShot · Post by **LongShot** » Sat Aug 24, 2002 1:35 pm

temjin wrote:danka = german for thanks

I always woundered what Vash meant when he said that.

UncleMilo · Post by **UncleMilo** » Sat Aug 24, 2002 2:48 pm

SarahtheBoring wrote:Whoa, whoa, wait a second. So you get to factor in ALL of anime, including those set outside Japan, but you're factoring out over half of the American movie industry PLUS movies set in England - and you claim not only that this is a fair comparison, but think that it's fair to bash <i>all of American culture</i> with that comparison?

I cry foul. Those are not equal parameters.

If you have your own personal vendetta against American culture or fetish for Japanese culture, then that's your own business. But don't pretend that they are rational or fair comparisons.

Wow... look at you ramble like a mad person.

One - I am not writing a thesis, nor am I in a debate - there are no rules and therefore, no way you can cry foul...

I mean you can... but since this is not an official debate, I can simply ignore your silly foul.

Two - I am not factoring in all anime... not at all. Japanese culture is very Xenophobic, but artists often are the more open minded in any culture.

I simply pointed out that there are anime titles where there are NO Japanese characters.

Now... I don't count movies from England because many of those in American find their heritage from England. It's too close to count. Furthermore... some of the movies set in England are not Hollywood productions - they are made in England and distributed by Hollywood (and that's not the same thing)

Three - CALM THE HELL DOWN. Just because I am ranking on America's ego doesn't mean I am bashing all American Culture.

AMERICA HAS AN EGO! DEAL WITH IT!

We are an amazingly egotistical nation... it is one of the bad things about America. We judge other nations based on our values, like everyone should be like us. If you just want to sit their with that smug "America, love it or leave it" attitude, then you are the more dangerous to America's future than I. It is important to find what is wrong with our nation so that we can work to make it better... not just turn a blind eye and take a hissy if someone dares say anything bad about it.

JAPAN HAS PLENTY OF ISSUES TOO! Example - Like I said, they are incredibly Xenophobic...

The Hollywood machine is a nightmare - trust me... what little experience I have had with it is horrifying - The way scripts are torn about for better marketing - the way things are dumbed down to gain the highest market share - the backstabbing - the politics - and worst of all... uneducated people in positions of power calling shots over the actual creative minds.

The Indie scene is much better, but harder to get to.

There are plenty of good movies that come out both in the big market and in the indie scene...

but in the big market, you will always see American Actors playing the roles, no matter if they are the correct ethnicity or not.

That's because Hollywood doesn't believe you, the audience, would want to see a movie unless there's a big name.

Why does Disney release Spirited Away in English? I mean... it is the highest grossing movie ever to come out of Japan to date, outselling Titanic.

Why? Because you, the audience, are too stupid for subtitles... and a bigger share will be made with ENGLISH voices.

Why is Shaolin Soccer being changed to Kung-Fu Soccer here in America? WHy... because Hollywood decided that you, the audience, are too stupid to know what Shaolin means... it's some crazy foriegn word... so make is something more people will understand and more will come to see this movie.

Who cares how well it did in its own country... it's got to be dubbed and changed to make it more accesible to Americans.

I could write for hours about things that have been ruined all in the name of dumbing down for mass American appeal.

My argument is not about bashing Americans...

I'm bashing on the Hollywood INdustry.

Get that into your brain before you give me a rant as stupid as that one I just had to read.

Remember - Warner Brothers says that women don't even watch animation.

Escaflowne and Cardcaptor Sakura were hacked up so they could be marketed to boys age 6-12...

that's the only people who watch animation according to the big American Entertainment machine.

Since you have taken a frivilous topic and turned it into this absurdity, I have no more interest in hearing from you.

Your extremist nature is annoying at best.

-Uncle Milo

SarahtheBoring · Post by **SarahtheBoring** » Mon Aug 26, 2002 9:54 pm

Heh, extremist - that's ironic.

This isn't really worth arguing over, though. I fail to see any anger in my post - amusement is more like it. Why would I get angry over something as trivial as anime? Whatever, otaku... believe what you like.

MistyCaldwell · Post by **MistyCaldwell** » Tue Aug 27, 2002 1:15 am

I can see what Uncle Milo is getting at. I get very tired of seeing the same high payed actors in a movie every year when the roles called for want something more.

There are few actors in this country I look at as being good. I'm going to name some names :p Harrison Ford, Robin Williams, Helen Hunt, Ben Affleck, Julia Roberts, and so on...these people are good actors. But when I look at them, they have played SO very many roles that I just can't drop that at the door and look at them in a fresh way.

Plus, they aren't exactly type cast but there are certain parts of their acting that I can identify in every role I see them in. They say super star, I say stale. Even when some of these people do comedy or drama, action or thriller, they still retain and carry something to EVERY role they play.

But I guess that isn't necessarily bad acting, just...well...hollywood is the best at recycling more than any other place on earth. Ideas, actors, you name it.

Maybe it doesn't help that the idea of a celebrity doesn't impress me much at all, who knows.

It would be nice to see subtitled movies released on the scale so called blockbusters do. And with actors that no one could name, yes that would be refreshing...but does any industrialized nation even do that?

kthulhu · Post by **kthulhu** » Tue Aug 27, 2002 2:54 am

France, although I doubt you could call them civilized or industrialized

, and Germany both have a respectable film industry using local actors. I know that I enjoyed "Run Lola Run" immensely, even though it was subtitled and it didn't have any big names. Must be because my mom is big on off the beaten path movies and made me watch them growing up, like "Time Of The Gypsies", a sad Yugoslavian film about a Yugoslavian kid who gets mixed up with some Gypsies and...well, you have to watch it.

fungku · Post by **fungku** » Wed Aug 28, 2002 10:43 pm

I agree with you on just about everything milo... especially the american ego...
My girlfriend has relatives from texas that come visit every year... i couldn't help noticing..
I also travelled around China for 2 months... I met some americans in Beijing and Hong Kong, at some 'foreigner' hang-out spots...
I also noticed their ego, and how they compare everything based on their values, and way of life...

*sees someone doin something differently then they would*
"Why are they doin' it like that, it's stupid. We don't do it liek that in america."

was a common attitude

Don't get me wrong, I'm not sayin all americans are like that... and i blame it on american media for the ones that are like that...

When I was in Beijing I met three US Harvard students who were working in Hong Kong, and they were on vacation. They were on the list of top ten most open-minded, nice people I have met...
so don't think I'm bashing ALL americans or american culture...

/...... I could go on for hours..... and especially since this is the Anime forum...

rinoa_leonheart · Post by **rinoa_leonheart** » Wed Aug 28, 2002 11:59 pm

i watched blood last month on wowow, there were several english to japanese transitions.

fungku · Post by **fungku** » Thu Aug 29, 2002 12:05 am

Oh yeah, almost forgot what I was origianlly gonna post..
Cowboy Bebop has a lot of engrish