Christianity in Anime

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Otohiko
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Post by Otohiko » Sat Jul 09, 2005 7:36 pm

x_rex30 wrote: Creators are going to make stories about anything they find cool, and if christianity is just something they find interesting for a story they might just add it to there story.
Indeed. And look at literature in general - allusions to theological themes are everywhere. Anime and Japan in general aren't really any kind of exception here. It's really a matter of individual perspective, and it's up to the creator who may or may not ignore the sensibilities of a certain religious group.

(Interesting by the way - I've read in a number of sources that Naoko Takeuchi, the creator of Sailormoon, is Christian - but that certainly doesn't seem to have any huge bearing on her work)

***

From my standpoint, which I'm sure doesn't sit well with everyone - I approach Christianity and its' treatment in art and entertainment as I do the treatment of any other world mythology.
The Birds are using humanity in order to throw something terrifying at this green pig. And then what happens to us all later, that’s simply not important to them…

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Dylan's forcelance
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Post by Dylan's forcelance » Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:25 am

quote]
Wow, that's remarkably short-sighted. Expecting something from a culture to which your arbitrary set of morals is as alien as theirs is to your culture to conform completely to your set of 'moral values'. I can't even think of an analogy to exemplify how... odd... this is.[/quote]
:? I think you misunderstood me. I am saying that it is a good thing to have different kinds of anime for different kinds of people. That way it can suit everyone's moral value individually. I don't think anyone should be left out. No matter what their value system is. Is that a more clear way of putting it? Everyone has different morals. Wouldn't it be wrong to shut them out because of it? Lets all be a little less close minded. That way everyone can enjoy anime. :wink:

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OtakuMan22
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Post by OtakuMan22 » Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:55 am

Actually, I think there is a bit of miscommunication going on here.

Dylan's forcelance, you have a good point being made, but it is getting confused amidst the context of this thread.

You claim that you like moral values in your anime, and that's good. It's the notion that good things can happen to good people and those who do bad will have bad done to them. Just like karma.

However, because this thread is on religion in anime, when you refer to "moral values", people assume you are referring to "Christian values" and ONLY Christian values. Not to say that they are bad values, not in the least! Love thy neighbor, thou shalt not steal, and so on.

Basically, by good moral anime, you're talking about stuff that promotes good traits in people, REGARDLESS of religion.

Counterpointing this is the anime that have little to no redeeming value in their characters. Granted, these are few and far in between, but for those that enjoy a good anti-hero, or where things do not end happily ever after, there is an anime for them as well.

One that comes to mind is the Go Nagai series Devil Man and the sequel Violence Jack. Using over the top shock and awe sex and gore, Go Nagai got quite a razzing from the Japanese PTA for the true gruesomness in his stories, especially those. I remember a friend showing me the Devil Man OAV from Manga Entertainment, and they had this club/orgy thing going on where the host was trying to bait demons with the sin of the party goers. If the debauchery was powerful enough, then the demons would infest the human hosts, and all hell would cut loose. It worked... almost too well, and the episodes were not pretty to say the least.

Furthermore, if you know how the story ends and how it goes from Devil Man to Violence Jack, then you can see how this can be deep, dark, and maybe depressing stuff with little moral value that can be taken away from it, if any.

No moral value, but still entertainment, and for some people, it's just what they were looking for!

Go Nagai is not a bad person to say the least! He's made history with some of the anime and manga he did back in the 1970's, and still does the odd job here and there today! I even believe he was called to help with the Gekigangar 3 segments of Nadesico, because who would know 70's robot anime better than him?

The point is, Kalium, is that if you want wanton destruction and violence in your anime, you can have that! If you want deep thought provoking stories of science fiction that make you wonder about politics, life, death, the enviornment, and yes, even religion, then there's an anime for you. If you want an anime to watch with your little brother or sister, then there's bound to be one for you. If you want action, romance, comedy... you get the idea!

So hopefully that dispels the confusion. Morality and religion are NOT one and the same. Many religions follow the same basic principles! Buddhism and Christianity both have high belief in an after-life, and that what you do now in the present with have a karmic reflection later down the road. Also, standards of what is acceptable and what isn't changes from culture to culture. Christians in the USA may look at Japanese Christians and notice the different lifestyles between them because regardless, there are still large cultural differences between the two. I believe one traditional Japanese holiday revolves around the harvest (either planting or gathering) where they give offerings to local deities or attend prayers at shrines more out of tradition instead of beliefs. (It's during this time that those popular goldfish scoop games appear)

On the flipside of the coin, there's Christmas in Japan. Less of a religious holiday and more of a great time for sales and commercial marketing. The argument can go for the USA as well! :)

But anyway, that's more ranting and tangenting, and I think I made my point. Hope that helps.

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Knowname
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Post by Knowname » Sun Jul 10, 2005 4:16 am

Tsunami Jones wrote: Ninja Resurrection basically has no connection to Ninja Scroll except for some ninja and a Jubei (Jubei Yagyu compared to Jubei Kimagure or whatever is name is).

And yes, there really is no sensitivity to religion in it. Here's basically what happens:
spoiler wrote:The son of god is reborn and leads the japanese christians to rebellion. Ninja are sent after him, and Jubei Yagyu beats him down. After having his arms cut of, the "christ" is then RAPED before dying. The end result being that satan is brought into the world to destroy it.
Pretty stupid overall, not just from a Christian viewpoint.
wow, hehe I may just be a biased christian somewhere deep down but I like to give everything a fare chance even if it's Spawn or, no matter how touchy, but this is... just... wow! Thanks for the warning ;p

Is that Jubei Yagyu from Jubei-chan... or just based off the same myth??

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Otohiko
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Post by Otohiko » Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:49 am

I think they're both based off a real historical figure, actually.
The Birds are using humanity in order to throw something terrifying at this green pig. And then what happens to us all later, that’s simply not important to them…

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Dylan's forcelance
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Post by Dylan's forcelance » Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:10 pm

:) Thank you otakuman22. And I am sorry if I didn't word everything exactly right. I was simply trying to say "Lets have enough anime to keep everyone happy" and you made my point alot more clear then I did. Thank you and sorry for the trouble :?

-DF

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Yuki Kedamono
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Post by Yuki Kedamono » Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:17 pm

wow that's alot to read... ::sweats::

I'm all up for christianity in anime and all.... (being christian and what-not) i just don't find it... fitting. unless they can shmooze a story based from the bible or something into an anime... heck... i know that i'm not that talented...

(evangalion is one... though it isn't christian based really... it just talks alot about adam and heaven and creation and blah blah blah... Angel Sanctuary is another... though there's too much basic discussion about the two main characters incest love affair to really be christian either.. ^__^)

being that anime and manga are typically japanese... ( :roll: ) most japanese are buddhist or into charms, spells to ward away demons, chants and luck and other things like that... so you'd generally find anime or manga about demons or priests and prietess' o rmonks and whatever else... so seeing a christian anime or manga... is bit strange.. though I would welcome it with open arms!!! ^__^
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EmilLang1000
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Post by EmilLang1000 » Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:42 pm

Well, considering, even most AMERICAN shows with Christian themes often get things screwed up in one way or another.

Though I do see what you're saying; even though the Japanese consider themselves a Western culture, they still have so many allusions to their own mythology and religious dogma, often, that it seems out of place to have Christianity involved - though to them, it's probably correct, because they live there afterall, and the interaction the Japanese characters have with Christianity is probably acurate to real life in Japan.

One of the best examples, though, where Christianity seems correct, is Hellsing. Considering that NONE of the characters are Japanese, their relation with the Judeo-Christian faiths seems a little more natural. I doubt that it's Anime itself that makes it seem odd to have Christian themes involved, but instead the primarily Buddhist and Shinto main characters of the stories.
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Knowname
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Post by Knowname » Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:55 pm

EmilLang1000 wrote:One of the best examples, though, where Christianity seems correct, is Hellsing. Considering that NONE of the characters are Japanese, their relation with the Judeo-Christian faiths seems a little more natural. I doubt that it's Anime itself that makes it seem odd to have Christian themes involved, but instead the primarily Buddhist and Shinto main characters of the stories.
Don't wanna argue anything but Hellsing... correct??? nooooooo

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Post by HeavyMetal » Mon Jul 11, 2005 12:32 am

I don't find Japanese adaptations of Christianity to anime any more strange than anything else. The number of branches in Christianity is weird enough. Plus the couple of home grown religions in the US like Mormon. I think the Western world has just as strange a take.

I'm still trying to figure out the cross as a symbol. It was a Roman murder weapon. Not to mention it was a spear wound that killed Christ. But it is cool symbol especially in Trigun.
being that anime and manga are typically japanese... ( Rolling Eyes ) most japanese are buddhist or into charms, spells to ward away demons, chants and luck and other things like that... so you'd generally find anime or manga about demons or priests and prietess' o rmonks and whatever else... so seeing a christian anime or manga... is bit strange.. though I would welcome it with open arms!!! ^__^
ummm.......yeah. Spells and charms???? One to many Miko anime me thinks.

Most cultures tend to have weird little idiosyncracies. Like saying bless you after someone sneezes. I think most people no longer believe that sneezes release demons. Unless demon is another word for snot.

Not to mention gargoyles on churches are also to ward away evil spirits. But I don't think most Christians really think that. (Carved pumpkins are for same purpose as well, but I think most people just like candy.)

I think it may just be fun to make anime or any show about cultural exaggerations with a historical perspective, like a story about King Author and Mrylin in the west.

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