The Ultimate Anime Battle : Dubbed VS Subbed
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LittleKefalos
- Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2002 12:09 am
Well
I think that the best way to watch an anime is both dubbed and subbed.
There are a few reasons for this.
1. They often screw up the translation anyways (I don't know Japanese but sometimes I can tell by a character's reaction, and the fact that they mention the another character's name which just happens to not be translated. Of course it is very difficult to translate between languages so I don't blame the translaters, I know another language, and I know that some words are nearly impossible to translate without giving a paragraph description of what they mean.
2. Some of the cultural references in language don't make sense or sound stupid when said in English, of course you should watch the Japanese to see the differences and help you understand a bit better about the Japanese culture.
3. The voice nuances in both languages are different so you pick up a different feel by watching both. For example, in Tenchi OAV I was a bit more sympathetic to Ryoko in the English version and I was a bit more sympathetic to Ayeka in the Japanese version (shows what talent can do huh?) Voice actors can make you appreciate a character more, for instance the English voice actor of Washu (again in Tenchi OAV) made me appreciate Washu more than the Japanese version could, but the reverse is often true.
4. DVD's are made with both. So why not take advantage? That's one of the main reasons I get DVD's. Sorry about really plugging the Tenchi OAV, but it has two subbed tracks and one dubbed track (the subbed tracks are for the most part the same, but some parts are completely different. Also the music tracks are in English and Japanese, now that's cool).
5. It is often more entertaining to watch an anime in your preffered mode. (so we need both, obviously as indicated by this forum).
6. (this is similar to what I said above) In some series it is clear that the voice actors for some of the charactor's are better in one language, and others are better in the other. Watch Ranma 1/2 and just try to tell me that Kuno is better in Japanese (one misses out on the comedy of how he speaks if one only watches the Japanese, unless one is Japanese) of course Ranma (as a guy), Ryoga, Akane, Nabiki and most of the other characters are better in Japanese, but if you watch them a while subbed you actually start liking their voices believe it or not (and it doesn't make you hate the Japanese).
Some animes with great voice actors on at both sides:
--Tenchi series (all of them, but Tokyo was kind of not so great, but it was like this all around)
--Princess Mononoke
--Akira
--Metropolis
--Ranma (it depends largely on the character) I like Kuno and Ranma girl in English, the rest of the characters in Japanese, but Shampoo is great in either (I gotta see the OAV:) haven't seen it all though
--DBZ (it was so long the voice actors had to get good) No one's watched everything except for the fanatics (the Bu saga has good examples of voice acting though, including the longest day episodes)
--Berserk (I think they're just plain better in English, the DVD's haven't all been released yet)
--Lain was good (I only saw two episodes though)
--Ghost in a Shell (I only saw the English though, sorry I don't own it yet)
--Ninja Scroll
-- Blood the Last Vampire (not that great of a movie mind you), but the voice acting is done as a mix of English and Japanese inherently how about that?
--I haven't watched as animes as I would have liked to, so I can't give a greater overview, sorry. (I guess I was a bit lengthy)
There are a few reasons for this.
1. They often screw up the translation anyways (I don't know Japanese but sometimes I can tell by a character's reaction, and the fact that they mention the another character's name which just happens to not be translated. Of course it is very difficult to translate between languages so I don't blame the translaters, I know another language, and I know that some words are nearly impossible to translate without giving a paragraph description of what they mean.
2. Some of the cultural references in language don't make sense or sound stupid when said in English, of course you should watch the Japanese to see the differences and help you understand a bit better about the Japanese culture.
3. The voice nuances in both languages are different so you pick up a different feel by watching both. For example, in Tenchi OAV I was a bit more sympathetic to Ryoko in the English version and I was a bit more sympathetic to Ayeka in the Japanese version (shows what talent can do huh?) Voice actors can make you appreciate a character more, for instance the English voice actor of Washu (again in Tenchi OAV) made me appreciate Washu more than the Japanese version could, but the reverse is often true.
4. DVD's are made with both. So why not take advantage? That's one of the main reasons I get DVD's. Sorry about really plugging the Tenchi OAV, but it has two subbed tracks and one dubbed track (the subbed tracks are for the most part the same, but some parts are completely different. Also the music tracks are in English and Japanese, now that's cool).
5. It is often more entertaining to watch an anime in your preffered mode. (so we need both, obviously as indicated by this forum).
6. (this is similar to what I said above) In some series it is clear that the voice actors for some of the charactor's are better in one language, and others are better in the other. Watch Ranma 1/2 and just try to tell me that Kuno is better in Japanese (one misses out on the comedy of how he speaks if one only watches the Japanese, unless one is Japanese) of course Ranma (as a guy), Ryoga, Akane, Nabiki and most of the other characters are better in Japanese, but if you watch them a while subbed you actually start liking their voices believe it or not (and it doesn't make you hate the Japanese).
Some animes with great voice actors on at both sides:
--Tenchi series (all of them, but Tokyo was kind of not so great, but it was like this all around)
--Princess Mononoke
--Akira
--Metropolis
--Ranma (it depends largely on the character) I like Kuno and Ranma girl in English, the rest of the characters in Japanese, but Shampoo is great in either (I gotta see the OAV:) haven't seen it all though
--DBZ (it was so long the voice actors had to get good) No one's watched everything except for the fanatics (the Bu saga has good examples of voice acting though, including the longest day episodes)
--Berserk (I think they're just plain better in English, the DVD's haven't all been released yet)
--Lain was good (I only saw two episodes though)
--Ghost in a Shell (I only saw the English though, sorry I don't own it yet)
--Ninja Scroll
-- Blood the Last Vampire (not that great of a movie mind you), but the voice acting is done as a mix of English and Japanese inherently how about that?
--I haven't watched as animes as I would have liked to, so I can't give a greater overview, sorry. (I guess I was a bit lengthy)
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Clara Yuri Asaki
- Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2002 1:37 pm
- Location: Where the Goddesses sleep in each other's arms peacefully... Loves: Shoujo-Ai and Yuri
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Nah, not too lenghty at all! 
I think the tranlations are getting "messed up" because they've evovled past simple literal tranlations. It's more like a form of poetry or so now. Rewriting the translations as an art. This is not bad, it just shows why they're changing so much. Of course, cultural references are hard to explain too.... but not changing them worked perfectly in the Excel Saga dub. I'm very very open-minded to different things, so watching anime subbed and seeing alot of cultural references was no problem for me.
I really don't get annoyed by the voices of the Japanese version, I just sometimes find the English voice to be better. Ok.. actually, that's kinda rare. This really didn't start happening till I heard Jessica Calvello's voice in Excel Saga. (Yes, I've mentioned her name like a million times, but that's cause I really really like her voice!) Also, you can tell that ADV and their voice actors actually watched the anime and found out which tones of voice to use in ALL the scenes. There was actually a major improvement in the Dub. There were alot of scenes in the Dub where a char might scream at a certain part and it would make sence, then we you watch it in Sub and they didn't scream, you wondered why.
Yeah, I get all my anime in DVD now... but even so, you still end up watching both versions and trying to figure out which one is better for whatever reason. But that's cool to watch both versions! It's definetly good to do that! But not always will one be better than the other, right? And that's when you know both versions are well done! Which is how all anime should be! It's nice to see that the songs are being dubbed too. The remake of the Perfect Blue song Ai No Tenshi, Angel of Love, was great! The remake of the opening of Magic Knight Rayearth was just as heart-warming as the original! Yeah, even the remake of the Sailor Moon opening was Ok.
Most of the animes that seem to get good dubs are the higher quality movies. But of course, good dubbing is spreading! And the breakthrough of permenant great anime dubbing will come from Excel Saga! All you domestic anime companies, take some notes! It's time to excel anime in America!
Quick question, cause I'm confused a bit. Is there actually a country named Japan? I though they called it Nippon. I've never heard a Sub say "Japan", but in Cardcaptor Sakura, Li does say "Nippon" when the translation mentions the word Japanese. But then in Excel Saga's sub, in the Sports episode, "Japan" is said in the sub. But I think that was suppose to be an American rooting for Japan or something. I don't know, do any of you?
I think the tranlations are getting "messed up" because they've evovled past simple literal tranlations. It's more like a form of poetry or so now. Rewriting the translations as an art. This is not bad, it just shows why they're changing so much. Of course, cultural references are hard to explain too.... but not changing them worked perfectly in the Excel Saga dub. I'm very very open-minded to different things, so watching anime subbed and seeing alot of cultural references was no problem for me.
I really don't get annoyed by the voices of the Japanese version, I just sometimes find the English voice to be better. Ok.. actually, that's kinda rare. This really didn't start happening till I heard Jessica Calvello's voice in Excel Saga. (Yes, I've mentioned her name like a million times, but that's cause I really really like her voice!) Also, you can tell that ADV and their voice actors actually watched the anime and found out which tones of voice to use in ALL the scenes. There was actually a major improvement in the Dub. There were alot of scenes in the Dub where a char might scream at a certain part and it would make sence, then we you watch it in Sub and they didn't scream, you wondered why.
Yeah, I get all my anime in DVD now... but even so, you still end up watching both versions and trying to figure out which one is better for whatever reason. But that's cool to watch both versions! It's definetly good to do that! But not always will one be better than the other, right? And that's when you know both versions are well done! Which is how all anime should be! It's nice to see that the songs are being dubbed too. The remake of the Perfect Blue song Ai No Tenshi, Angel of Love, was great! The remake of the opening of Magic Knight Rayearth was just as heart-warming as the original! Yeah, even the remake of the Sailor Moon opening was Ok.
Most of the animes that seem to get good dubs are the higher quality movies. But of course, good dubbing is spreading! And the breakthrough of permenant great anime dubbing will come from Excel Saga! All you domestic anime companies, take some notes! It's time to excel anime in America!
Quick question, cause I'm confused a bit. Is there actually a country named Japan? I though they called it Nippon. I've never heard a Sub say "Japan", but in Cardcaptor Sakura, Li does say "Nippon" when the translation mentions the word Japanese. But then in Excel Saga's sub, in the Sports episode, "Japan" is said in the sub. But I think that was suppose to be an American rooting for Japan or something. I don't know, do any of you?
- ^_^ Love and more love! ^_^ -
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Clara Yuri Asaki
- Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2002 1:37 pm
- Location: Where the Goddesses sleep in each other's arms peacefully... Loves: Shoujo-Ai and Yuri
- Contact:
Quick mini-game
I just wanna say this real quick too....
Do any of you know where my avatar comes from? I'll give you something cool in your e-mail if you can tell me. (I cut out exactly 80x80 pixels from the original pic to get my avatar, by the way.)
Anyways.. continue on with this discussion!
Do any of you know where my avatar comes from? I'll give you something cool in your e-mail if you can tell me. (I cut out exactly 80x80 pixels from the original pic to get my avatar, by the way.)
Anyways.. continue on with this discussion!
- ^_^ Love and more love! ^_^ -
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LittleKefalos
- Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2002 12:09 am
Just short
Now that the forumn works I can say that obviously I agree with Clara Yuri Asaki, of course I haven't read every single one of your messages, but about the sub-dub wars anyways. Both are good.
Also I think that in many of the animes characters seem to say Ni-chan instead of just chan as an endearing term to the older characters. Now I don't know Japanese, but (and this is just a thought).... maybe its Ni-pon
maybe an endearing term for their country?
Rember its just a thought, ok.
Also I think that in many of the animes characters seem to say Ni-chan instead of just chan as an endearing term to the older characters. Now I don't know Japanese, but (and this is just a thought).... maybe its Ni-pon
maybe an endearing term for their country?
Rember its just a thought, ok.
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temaranight
- Joined: Tue Mar 19, 2002 5:51 pm
- Location: Gulf Coast
- Contact:
my 2 cents...agian.. 
I like both sub and dub..and thankfully..yes..better dubs are coming out..mayhaps this is because American companies are seeing such an increase in anime sales here that they are willing to spend more money on the actors...and *gasp* possibly want to get fan input as well
Hey..it could happen....
I like both sub and dub..and thankfully..yes..better dubs are coming out..mayhaps this is because American companies are seeing such an increase in anime sales here that they are willing to spend more money on the actors...and *gasp* possibly want to get fan input as well
Hey..it could happen....
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Clara Yuri Asaki
- Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2002 1:37 pm
- Location: Where the Goddesses sleep in each other's arms peacefully... Loves: Shoujo-Ai and Yuri
- Contact:
Your thought is good LittleKefalos. But with what you said, it would seem that they would actually say "Nijapan, or Janipan". Li was talking about Japanese Kanji, if that goes into your thought, by the way. I was thinking that whoever named the country for Americans, had just messed up the translations or something. Or just changed it on purpose for whatever reason. For example, China is actually called The People's Rebuplic of China. Of course that also applies to America and The United States of America. Ahhhh... this theory is getting messed up! I don't know..... 
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Anime companies don't need money for good actors, they just need to find Anime fans that would love to voice act. Of course it wouldn't be for free. But having that passion for anime will bring out way better voice acting than any amount of money will ever do.
But the dub voices actors for Princess Mononoke aren't anime fans..... Of course, they're all professional actors. But just listen to Jessica Calvello's high-spirit-full-passion-super-enthusiastic-insane-cool Dub for Excel Saga's Excel, and you'll hear that Passion really does bring out better voice actors than money can.
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Anime companies don't need money for good actors, they just need to find Anime fans that would love to voice act. Of course it wouldn't be for free. But having that passion for anime will bring out way better voice acting than any amount of money will ever do.
But the dub voices actors for Princess Mononoke aren't anime fans..... Of course, they're all professional actors. But just listen to Jessica Calvello's high-spirit-full-passion-super-enthusiastic-insane-cool Dub for Excel Saga's Excel, and you'll hear that Passion really does bring out better voice actors than money can.
- ^_^ Love and more love! ^_^ -
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LittleKefalos
- Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2002 12:09 am
I just have to add a few more bits.
It seems that the first anime formerly young anime fans in America are beginning to enter the professional world, and perhaps choosing fields which involve making anime in the U.S. and English speaking world. Undoubtably as the fan base grows in a country (assuming that fans don't lose interest as they grow older) more skillfull individuals will come forward to work on anime projects raising the overall quality.
Maybe I'm a bit premature in this, but just as American animation has influenced Japanese animation, there may be a reciprical influence, with the next generation of cartoonists being influenced by Japanese as well as American cartoons (I think we're already starting to see this somewhat), and this will create a greater market for anime, raising the quality of subs like we can't believe and also getting rid of this argument. People will want the great quality subs and the great quality dubs (not just one). And so it will be.
Remember I said maybe (more like I hope).
Oh yeah also about Ni-pon what I meant was maybe Pon means country.
Oh yeah this is Japan in Japanese ----->日本,
I don't know how that might help, but there goes (I used alta vista), I'm going to check a book as soon as I can though.
A digression is what you just observed
Well there goes that,
Ciao,
Alex
Maybe I'm a bit premature in this, but just as American animation has influenced Japanese animation, there may be a reciprical influence, with the next generation of cartoonists being influenced by Japanese as well as American cartoons (I think we're already starting to see this somewhat), and this will create a greater market for anime, raising the quality of subs like we can't believe and also getting rid of this argument. People will want the great quality subs and the great quality dubs (not just one). And so it will be.
Remember I said maybe (more like I hope).
Oh yeah also about Ni-pon what I meant was maybe Pon means country.
Oh yeah this is Japan in Japanese ----->日本,
I don't know how that might help, but there goes (I used alta vista), I'm going to check a book as soon as I can though.
A digression is what you just observed
Well there goes that,
Ciao,
Alex
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Clara Yuri Asaki
- Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2002 1:37 pm
- Location: Where the Goddesses sleep in each other's arms peacefully... Loves: Shoujo-Ai and Yuri
- Contact:
The people who brought Anime over to America in the first place obviously liked Anime theirselves, so that should've been reason enough to make them high quality. They shouldn't have waited for more fans. They might've got more fans faster if they made all dubs high quality to begin with. Well... that was a long time ago I guess. So, maybe not much was avaliable. But even then, Anime actually had good dub acting. The really old Anime "Warriors of The Wind" had good voice acting. I don't know about the rest. But then somehow, Anime companies got alittle careless (OK... ALOT really) with the dubbing. Then now, the quality is RISING INSANELY!!! OK.... that timeline is probably inaccurate..... I'm not even sure what I was trying to say.......
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American media is definetly being influenced by Japan and China more than ever! Now the looks of Anime, Japanese Kanji, and Chinese Characters have been dubbed as "Ah dude, those look tight!" It's definetly alot more acceptable now than it ever has been. The time of growth for Anime is at hand!!! Take thy pen and draw thicker than blood, anime that is full of heart and color!!! Even Hentai can grow here, because they are no censorship laws like those in Japan. Are those still there today? You know, the mosiac blockiness for censorship over male and female underparts. With Anime growing, now would be a great time for Japan's best to come over and make the most intense Hentais ever! The truth is, the mosiac censor takes away from the beauty of some Hentai. It makes it look ever dirtier than it really is. Did you all know that the censorship laws in Japan are the reason why the "tentacles" in Hentai were born? That was there away of getting around censorships. They literally just subsituted tenacles for a certain other body part. They made it work the same exact way. And somehow, it was just as effective.... if not more. Freaky?
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(Good luck on your research LittleKefalos! )
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American media is definetly being influenced by Japan and China more than ever! Now the looks of Anime, Japanese Kanji, and Chinese Characters have been dubbed as "Ah dude, those look tight!" It's definetly alot more acceptable now than it ever has been. The time of growth for Anime is at hand!!! Take thy pen and draw thicker than blood, anime that is full of heart and color!!! Even Hentai can grow here, because they are no censorship laws like those in Japan. Are those still there today? You know, the mosiac blockiness for censorship over male and female underparts. With Anime growing, now would be a great time for Japan's best to come over and make the most intense Hentais ever! The truth is, the mosiac censor takes away from the beauty of some Hentai. It makes it look ever dirtier than it really is. Did you all know that the censorship laws in Japan are the reason why the "tentacles" in Hentai were born? That was there away of getting around censorships. They literally just subsituted tenacles for a certain other body part. They made it work the same exact way. And somehow, it was just as effective.... if not more. Freaky?
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I really didn't mean for this to be an arguement ..... Just really intense discussion! I was hoping that most peolple would say that they like both subs and dubs. And alot of you do. And that's cool. Yeah! Go for it!LittleKefalos Says :
and also getting rid of this argument.
(Good luck on your research LittleKefalos!
) - ^_^ Love and more love! ^_^ -
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MistyCaldwell
- Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2002 10:04 pm
- Location: Virginia
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Clara Yuri Asaki wrote:Now the looks of Anime, Japanese Kanji, and Chinese Characters have been dubbed as "Ah dude, those look tight!" It's definetly alot more acceptable now than it ever has been.
Uh yeah...But most of those kanji people think look cool and put on their clothing, cars, tatoos, etc. probably just say: "Stupid gaijin! I take your money" ala Otakudom
