[beta.a-m-v.org] Hey, we're semi-official

[Nya-chan Production]

I also believe you will be keeping the random Banner feature correct?

No, he won't, I can inform you on that. I've already asked, and it was explained to me that this design is about pure effectivity and the banner is useless clutter. Or something along the way.

[Pwolf]

I also believe you will be keeping the random Banner feature correct?

No, he won't, I can inform you on that. I've already asked, and it was explained to me that this design is about pure effectivity and the banner is useless clutter. Or something along the way.

How about instead of bitching all the time you come up with an idea that could incorporate random banners and still keep good effective use of the site?

[Pwolf]

I also believe you will be keeping the random Banner feature correct?

The banner feature in it's current state, probably not but using the new banner/video system David has in his version of the site could be used for other content other than just a new video. I have an idea how to make it work and will do some mock ups when I get back from work.

[CodeZTM]

I also believe you will be keeping the random Banner feature correct?

No, he won't, I can inform you on that. I've already asked, and it was explained to me that this design is about pure effectivity and the banner is useless clutter. Or something along the way.

How about instead of bitching all the time you come up with an idea that could incorporate random banners and still keep good effective use of the site?

I'm sure Nya-Chan is feeling the same frustration that many of us are feeling at the moment. Lack of coding skills means that unless IFFTU (or one of the two/three other people on the project that knows coding) codes a particular feature that we currently use, and if administration clears the final website without it, we're going to lose a feature that we love utilizing. I'm feeling the same way with the opinion system and the current design philosophy, and I quite literally feel rather helpless about it.

Though I realize that this isn't the final state, and I'm patiently waiting before I start critiquing the entire project.

[Pwolf]

OK then, answer this question:

Would you rather nothing change at all or have someone working on a new site that may or may not have a feature you like? Point being, the "majority" of the people on this site want something new. Now that something new is in the works, you're frustrated you wont get what you want. Make up your mind. There's no way we can make everyone happy. The best approach is to do what you think will be best and let the people decide if it actually works. Considering there's nothing to really test at the moment, no one knows for sure if it will work.

An opinion system is a tough thing to get right. The current system isn't good but its not a problem that needs to be addressed right away. If you want to help, research and discuss with people how to tackle the problem and present David with your findings. He may actually use it. This requires absolutely no programming skills. No matter what website we end up with, this is something that would change either way.

The opinion system aside, think of ways, using David's design, to implement what you want. You're (not you specifically but in general) not helping anyone by bitching and whining about every little thing and making wild assumptions.

Anyway, stop being frustrated about what you don't see and either 1) talk to David and understand he's viewpoints about why he's doing what he's doing or 2) let him do his thing and see what the end product is.

[BasharOfTheAges]

Consider tone in general. It seems like anyone posting feedback in the feedback thread is being told to STFU by the tone of the posts. Several people that just responded had to be coaxed into it and several more are too afraid to post now because they'll just get their heads bitten off.

I get this nagging feeling this is all just a set-up for us to collectively say "alright we give up, what we have now isn't really that bad."

[Pwolf]

The only person being told to STFU, essentially, is Nya. David has responded to every comment with reasonable information that backs up his decisions. Just because he doesn't immediately agree with you doesn't mean you should shut up and go away. On the other side of the coin, just because you have an idea doesn't mean he has to like it either. "If you don't like it then fork the code" is a reasonable response to someone who doesn't like his ideas or wants to see something different.

[Taite]

I've taken two years of web-based/website design classes so my feedback may not be as helpful as someone who's taken more/has more experience.
However, in my experience, you figure out the structure of a website, usually by mapping, first. This involves writing out what links will go on the navigation on every page, other links and pages under those links, etc. Then you go on to design the structure of the pages, i.e., laying out where the navigation goes on a page, search bar, columns on the page, location of content, banner, etc.

Continuing to my point, you do that first, then you get to the aesthetics of the page. So what I don't understand is why people are complaining about what colors there should or shouldn't be or what the banner is going to look like or blah and blah when the basic structure of the beta isn't even figured out yet. In my opinion, though there is no one right way to go about making a site, I think it's more important that we or the person creating this has a set layout of the page, what content will be included, where it's going to go, what features to get rid of, etc, BEFORE the talk of stupid colors and what the site is going to look like.

Right now, the beta is hardly even a shell. At the very least, the navigation should be figured out. What's going to be included needs to be figured out. If we're re-designing the org, then we're redesigning the layout of the content in addition to the aesthetic design. However, lesser experienced people, no offense, are going to focus on what it looks like, rather than the layout. So I think this whole feedback thread is useless. Bickering about aesthetics is not nearly as important as how the hell you're going to navigate the site. Would you rather somebody come here and say "oh the home page is rather cold, this isn't like amvs at all" (which doesn't happen) or come here and say "WTF is happening, where do I go, how do I sign up, where's the forum?"

I don't know, maybe that's just me. Maybe I'm a bit late and that's all figured out. If it is, then I'd rather see that than a color scheme. So getting on, I think this thread is useless. None of what anyone brought up hardly matters. Whether or not a feature is going to be on the new site or not, like what was mentioned pages ago, does matter. Not colors. Not even what the featured videos are going to look like, not yet.

Imo, it's much too early for a feedback thread. I'm glad progress is being made, it looks like, but I'd rather the person making it focus on getting advice from individuals with more experience who understand how to build a site from the bottom up. However, this is just my method. The users should have a say in the site of course, but I would never present my client with a site so early on in the stages of production for this very reason.

Just me though.

[Radical_Yue]

I wonder if anyone who is bitching about the design realizes that this isn't even in a rough draft stage yet and only the basic functionality is really being ironed out right now...

It's like someone sending a 5 minute beta with 10 seconds done and 4:50 seconds of black space, then people bitching about the black space. The editor could withhold any progress whatsoever and leave everyone in the dark, then say "fuck you, it's done" but instead they're trying to keep people updated every step of the way.

I also wonder if anyone realizes that this single person has gotten more work done on the redesign in the past couple months than our entire team of admins have in the past 3+ years. But then again, not many people would know that considering that everything was being hid behind "it's happening behind closed doors" or whatever bullshit excuse was being used.

I'd prefer to continue the prioritization of "make shit work" over "make shit bootyful!!!11!!"

But then again, that's just me.


Also, thank you David. Thank you for doing something while others did nothing. But then again, if they would've known that attempting to help in any way would create this kind of bitch-fest, I can't really blame them for not doing shit in the first place.

Edit: Fuck yes, Taite. Fuck YES.

[Pwolf]

Taite: Are you going to NDK? Can I buy you a drink?