targa or BMP

[Kionon]

I second the request for citations. One can hardly consider themselves in academic good order if they do not provide citations for evidence used.

[post-it]

.. hehe .. isn't it amazing how patents being approved and people ingoring those patents can become "the facts" in a case that should not even be an issue .. hehe

.. "The LZW algorithm was incorporated from an open publication, and without knowledge that Unisys was pursuing a patent. The patent was brought to our attention, much to our displeasure, after the GIF spec had been published and passed into wide use.'' Tim Oren [then] Vice President of Future Technology at CompuServe.
.. "There are claims that Unisys was made aware of this as early as 1989 and chose to ignore the use in "pure software'' the documents to substantiate this claim have apparently been lost. Greg Roelofs
.. "Whether due to ongoing financial difficulties or as part of the industry-wide bonk on the head provided by the World Wide Web, Unisys in 1993 began aggressively pursuing commercial vendors of software-only LZW implementations . . ! ??? ! ?"

T_T

.. Unisys in 1993 began aggressively pursuing commercial vendors .. I thought you said that PNG didn't exist until 1995 ?? .. true; the name was changed four times .. but .. how can that be?? .. unless .. I grew-up during those times and remember what was going-on in those days? .. naah; that can't be it....
http://www.libpng.org/pub/png/pnghist.html ... Patents for Pure Software before Windows came along 0_o .. Anyone remember Sperry Univac, the leaders in Visual Police PhotoGrapic Evidence by 1985 .. or did Sperry, Univac, IBM and/or Unisys even exist before MicroSoft? .. http://www.libpng.org/pub/png/slashpng-1999.html .. I'm sure that Control Data still has most of finds of the MPEG research by the LZW patents and work compiled by and then implemented by Stefan Eckart.
.. PBS had a "Specail" on Steve Jobs in 1996 called "Triumph of the Nerds" .. in it, Steve Jobs was talking about "A Copier Company" who had Visual Graphics of the Daily New Paper "on Display" with a long-gated TV Screen at 1967 ( the street name excapes me ) and from it was born "The MAC" and "Lisa" .. Mouse and Graphics based Apples. .. OOPS!; forgot, it wasn't called "the Internet" back then - sorry ... it also changed its name T_T .. I can still remember using a Modem to access Comp-u-serv with a 1-800 number and it was free of charge to access "what we refer to today as the Internet." .. favorite places to visit, "The Mother Of All BBS's" .. yup! BBS Software was the original HTML software of the late 1980's .. well, that and IRC's which no one but College Professors could understand in those days

.. why bother with this old stuff about BBS's, Lisa, LZW, The MAC and PNG ?? because knowing where things actually began lets us ignore what we have today. Modems -- nobody uses them anymore! ( the first one I remember using came with my Radio Shack Model II tape storage Computer back in the 1970's ) Did you know that every computer made after 1976 used "BASIC" in one form or another? The Ti99 from Texas Instruments was the 2nd most affordable pint-sized computer ever made and it came in Kit Form ( you built it and programmed its ROM. ) .. yes, you heard right; "the Operating System" of the average Home Computer in the 1970's was in a ROM ( no virus can destroy a ROM ) [ kinda makes you wonder why we ever stopped using ROM's for Operating Systems -- talk about Virus Free computing ^__^ ]

.. it would be nice if what we believed in, in the 1970's, were true today with computers: in your pocket was your ROM, it could be plugged in to any computer. Update that to today by adding something we didn't have back then but we knew it was coming: Plug-in your USB Flash Memory for the Programs you want to run and Plug-in the USB Flash Memory to use as your Hard Drive. Connect to the Internet via a Hard-Wired Firewall and explore the Internet on ITS Browser. .. too simple you say? .. Moble Celuar Phones do it all the time -- why not have that freedom with your Computer?
.. kinda makes you wonder why The Supreme Court broke-up Ma-Bell in 1974 if Computers and Graphics didn't exist before 1995 considering that it was the Tele-Phones Camera and people using your telephone number against you while you were out shopping that prompted The Supreme Court to hand down THAT verdict in 1974. .. 0_0 .. TelePhone Cameras, why they weren't invented until Windows 95 was released .. right? .....

@LantisEscudo and Kionon .. somewhere along the line, people have forgotten the past by only stating half-truths .. those half-truths are being displayed as "The Truth in Fact!" and I'm as guilty as the next one when it comes to believing what I've read. However, as your teachers once told you in College, "Their Truth is not The Truth because They Are Trying To Make A Point as to what They Believe Should Be True."
.. what should have been remembered about PNG not being called PNG until 1995 was the question of, "where did GIF come from"

[LantisEscudo]

A few facts, taken directly from the authoritative source of PNG's history.

• The first draft of the PNG specification, first called PBF, was published to comp.graphics, comp.compression, and comp.infosystems.www.providers on January 4, 1995 by Thomas Boutell.
• The name PNG was adopted in Draft 5 of the specification on January 23, 1995.
• The basic specification was frozen at Draft 9 on March 7, 1995. Further drafts would only refine and clarify what was already set down.
• The PNG specification 1.0 was published as a W3C Proposed Recommendation on July 1, 1996.
• The Proposed Recommendation was confirmed on October 1, 1996.
• The "image/png" MIME type was approved by the IANA on October 14, 1996.

But all of this is beside the point.

Bottom line, you've made claims that you say are backed up by studies. We want to see those studies to verify your claims. Link or shut up.

[dokidoki]

There's only one way to resolve this.

[Kionon]

There's only one way to resolve this.

THREAD OVER.

[trythil]

it was found that TGA's could retain their structures up to 14 edits before Degradation could be measured

Code: Select all

#!/usr/bin/env ruby
require 'rubygems'
require 'RMagick'
include Magick

# throw in whatever 64x64 image you want
Original = 'test.tga'
New = 'test_new.tga'
times = 0

while true
  orig = Image.read(Original)[0]
  new = orig
  new.flip!
  new.flip!
  new.write New

  t1 = Image.read(Original)[0].get_pixels 0, 0, 64, 64
  t2 = Image.read(New)[0].get_pixels 0, 0, 64, 64

  raise "Data not equal" if t1 != t2
  puts "checked #{times}"
  times += 1
end

Let me know if that ever stops...

[trythil]

Well, actually, I meant

Code: Select all

#!/usr/bin/env ruby
require 'rubygems'
require 'ftools'
require 'RMagick'
include Magick

# use whatever 64x64 Targa you want here
Original = 'test.tga'
New = 'test_new.tga'
times = 0

while true
  orig = Image.read(Original)[0]
  new = orig
  new.flip!
  new.flip!
  new.write New

  t1 = Image.read(Original)[0].get_pixels 0, 0, 64, 64
  t2 = Image.read(New)[0].get_pixels 0, 0, 64, 64

  raise "Data not equal" if t1 != t2
  puts "checked #{times}"
  times += 1

  File.copy Original, New
end

(thanks Lantis)

Doesn't really affect the outcome, though.

But this thread's been totally derailed...

===

Targa and BMP both are lossless (assuming you stay within the color depth that each format supports), and both have wide format support. What you use will primarily be dependent on what works best in your workflow.

For example, for me, that usually ends up being stuff like Targa, PNG, or OpenEXR (depending on the required color depth, the programs involved, what kind of data I need to embed, etc.) since I can easily ship that stuff across multiple programs and operating systems.

[trythil]

Code: Select all

  File.copy Original, New

Clearly, I am way too tired to be a jerk, since I've pwned myself twice in this thread. That should, of course, be File.copy New, Original. Bleh. I think it's time for sleep.