Philosophy in Anime

[Kionon]

This topic is about the discussion of philosophical questions as shown in Japanese animation. For this topic, SPOILERS ARE NECESSARY. Let me say that again, because of the complexity of the arguments, much will have to be disclosed about the anime you are citing, and SPOILERS ARE UNAVOIDABLE. I also feel the spoiler tag would make discourse unacceptably restricted. This means, of course, that if you are particularly shy of spoilers, this may not be the topic for you. You participate, you accept that you have waived your right to complain about being spoiled.

Before explaining just what Philosophy in Anime means, let me be clear that the Philosophy of Anime is something else entirely. Philosophy of Anime would be concerned with questions like "What is anime?" "What purposes does anime serve?" "Are there subjects anime can't or shouldn't cover?" "Can anime really be good or bad?" While these questions are fascinating, they are much harder than what I propose to talk about here. This is not what I am asking, although if there is enough interest, that topic could be made.

More, what I am doing is looking to my fellow philosophers who have discussed Philosophy in courses such as Philosophy in Literature, Philosophy in Film, Philosophy in Science Fiction, Philosophy in the Media, and even Philosophy in Harry Potter (yes, real class) to apply the same search for examples to anime. These courses are concerned with the way that philosophical problems are presented in various forms of media. Let's look at some examples.

The issue of scepticism, such as Rene Descartes's Demon Deceiver, or more updated, Hilary Putnam's brain-in-vat scenario, could be looked at by examining the Matrix. This would be an example of Philosophy in Film.

The issue of whether or not there are moral limits to science could be looked at by reading Frankenstein. This would be an example of Philosophy in Literature.

We could consider the ways that journalists refer to different philosophical arguments as they relate them to breaking news. This would be an example of Philosophy in the Media.

We could even look at the nature of evil by comparing and contrasting Tom Riddle and Harry Potter, who despite their similar childhoods, have very different views about morality, if Tom could be said to have a morality (perhaps he was an aficionado of the 20th century existentialists, like Sartre, and considers morality, and evil, to be illusory). Yep, you guessed it, this would be Philosophy in Harry Potter.

So, let's consider anime. I will start. I will look at the issue of free will as portrayed in the ending episode of Kimagure Orange Road TV series, episodes 47 and 48.

Not much is known about the Madoka that is pre-Kyosuke. Most is conjecture based on canonical clues. I'll go ahead and explain my view of her biography based on logical conjectures drawn from said clues. You should shortly begin to see how it provides a definite challenge to the concept of free well.

We do know that Madoka falls in love with Kyosuke from the get go (as he does her) in the first moments of the first episode. We also know that she probably does so because of the time loop from episodes 47 and 48. I could probably write a very long biography on Madoka alone, so bear with me as I try to explain the depth of characterization that a casual KOR fan (much less a casual viewer) probably has not considered.

A chronology of Madoka Personality-Defining events would probably start with her parents permanently relocating to America but leaving Madoka in the care of her much older sister. Madoka's older sister is portrayed as the "good" or "perfect" daughter. The reasons why will not be be covered here. Madoka, feeling the strain of living up to her rich successful parents' standards (while being separated from them), and being raised by the "perfect daughter" older sister, rebels first by becoming a tomboy. Preteen Madoka is rough and ready, playing soccer, fighting boys, and generally acting male and masculine, including dressing like a boy to the point where other boys think she's one of them.

It is not until Kyosuke from 1988 shows up in 1982 due to a time loop and Preteen Madoka falls in love with him does she change her appearance. And yet, she really only changes her appearance dramatically. From what we're shown, we know that in the years from 1982 to 1987, Madoka grows her hair long and chooses to wear more feminine clothes based on the fact that Kyosuke described 1988 Madoka to 1982 Madoka when asked about what type of girl he "prefered." Confused yet? It gets better. Madoka still messes around with gangs, and has come to be known as "Madoka The Pick" for her skill at using guitar picks as throwing stars.

The first episode with the "Nice Catch" scene that is so famous, actually is a huge clue that ties right back into the last episodes of the series. Madoka is changing by 1987 and is pulling herself slowly out of the rough and tumble lifestyle she started in her younger years. The stairs scene in the start of the first episode is an example of the "non-delinquent" days Madoka has started to allow herself. At school and around the neighborhood, she is still thought of a delinquent and bully. Kyosuke of 1987 sees a Madoka he helped create in 1988 because he saw her as she appeared in 1987. Circular chronology! The basic point of the time loop is to suggest that Madoka would have continued on a self-destructive path had Kyosuke of 1988 not time looped to continue the process. Instead, Madoka would have been a much worse gangster, bully, and delinquent (as is shown in the alternate universe at play in episode 48 where Kyosuke does not exist). The bond of love between Kyosuke and Madoka literally compells the universe to unite them, and it thereby saves Madoka from becoming a truly horrible person.

So, how does this illustrate the problem of Free Will? If Madoka only exists as she is, with all of her choices from 1982 on because that was the path circular chronology shows she had to take in order to be Madoka in 1987, and so also in 1988, did Madoka really have any "choices" at all or Did Kyosuke take choice away from her? And if Kyosuke created the circumstances under which Madoka of 1987 would meet him, already turned into his ideal girl, the concept of he only has because of meeting Madoka, did he have a choice in falling for her? Is the meeting predestined as I suggest in the final paragraph of the summary? And even if it is, does this necessitate the choices being false?

Even if I grant predestination, which I don't, certainly not in a religious context, I don't feel that Madoka of 1982 was tricked into becoming Madoka of 1987/1988. While I think a certain path is obvious for us, as omiscient viewers, I do not think the path is obvious for Madoka. Despite making choices that were "right" according to the path that is obvious to us, I don't feel that negates Madoka's ability to choose. I believe her choices represent her true desires, and whether predestined or not, do represent Free Will. I believe this is equally true for Kyosuke. That what they would choose is so strongly supported by the universe is either a testament to their love, or Kyosuke's ESP skills, or both.

What do you think? What philosophical problems to do you see in your favorite anime? *picks up coffee and coughs* Talk amongst yerselves. *makes hand gesture to everyone.*

[Ishbalan]

tl; dnr

[Dar]

tl; dnr

[Otohiko]

wtf is a madoka

[Kionon]

wtf is a madoka

Do you not know, or are you making a point about personal identity: "Just who is this character we call Madoka?"

[Willen]

Ultimately, I believe Madoka changed because she wanted to. I think that she would have ended up the way she was at the beginning of the first episode regardless of whether Kyosuke went back in time and met her younger self. Based on her relationships with Hikaru, Yusaku, and her various delinquent acquaintances, she is a caring person inside with a strong sense of justice. Even the alternate future Madoka isn't really that far off from the one that we are familiar with.

Still, I have to wonder, since I've recently re-watched episode 36 (where they shoot their amateur film), if Madoka's comment at the end of the episode is foreshadowing.

[Kionon]

Ultimately, I believe Madoka changed because she wanted to. I think that she would have ended up the way she was at the beginning of the first episode regardless of whether Kyosuke went back in time and met her younger self. Based on her relationships with Hikaru, Yusaku, and her various delinquent acquaintances, she is a caring person inside with a strong sense of justice. Even the alternate future Madoka isn't really that far off from the one that we are familiar with.

Still, I have to wonder, since I've recently re-watched episode 36 (where they shoot their amateur film), if Madoka's comment at the end of the episode is foreshadowing.

In this case you make an even stronger case for predestination than I did: you say she would have changed even if Kyosuke did not appear in 1982. The how do you explain parallel-Madoka, where she only seems to change after meeting Kyosuke. Note too alternate Yuu and Hikaru, they are also much worse for the lack of Kyosuke.

Are you suggesting Madoka knew? I've grappled with this myself. Ano Hi does not seem to address this at all, which, despite how much I love it without reference to ESP, I was still surprised by.

You don't have to stick to Madoka's personal identity and free will, unless you feel you have more to add. By all means, produce your own example of philosophy in anime.

[hasteroth]

I have to say that there are a few anime that touch on philosophy but the vast majority are purely for entertainment. And most anime that do touch on this subject do not even present original arguments but rather reuse tired old ones.

Now if this was about psychology I could go on and on and on... but my personal philosophy is ridiculously simple and I don't care to analyze the philosophies of others.

[hasteroth]

And if I might point someone towards an anime that could make for interesting discussion (or not, depends on how you see it)

see Welcome to the NHK

[Ishbalan]

I have to say that there are a few anime that touch on philosophy but the vast majority are purely for entertainment. And most anime that do touch on this subject do not even present original arguments but rather reuse tired old ones.

AKA Here comes another EVA moment.