Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

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Rei-chan_AMV
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by Rei-chan_AMV » Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:26 pm

TnAdct1 wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:09 pm
3. So, which "Letting Go" video is the one that made the finals?
It's mine this time. I wish they would have put the creator's name next to each video title instead of solely emailing us separately. I know there's recently been a minimum of 3 "Letting Go" AMVs that have been applying to competitions and we're all in the same categories, so just having our names added would save a little bit of confusion.

My bad guys- one day I aspire to come up with creative titles (^_^;)

JerryLi
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by JerryLi » Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:10 pm

AX AMV Team 2.0 wrote:
The creator was gracious enough not to submit their AMV for consideration in the Drama Category in our competition, instead, decided to submit in a less competitive category.

Doesn't that also contradict this rule on their categories page of their website?
i.e. this part https://imgur.com/MU6FY3O

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Yuusharo
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by Yuusharo » Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:24 pm

JerryLi wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:10 pm
AX AMV Team 2.0 wrote:
The creator was gracious enough not to submit their AMV for consideration in the Drama Category in our competition, instead, decided to submit in a less competitive category.

Doesn't that also contradict this rule on their categories page of their website?
i.e. this part https://imgur.com/MU6FY3O
Category placement is inherently subjective. It's usually up to the coordinators to determine the criteria that makes up each category. For example, what defines Drama vs Sentiments?

It's tricky enough when one team is responsible for drafting the categories. It becomes more so when a completely different team inherits the categories and rules and makes almost no attempt to change them into their own vision. What we considered "Rhythm & Beat" is different from what another team would accept.

In fairness, I could see an argument made to place that specific entry into Rhythm & Beat. What I cannot understand is why they made an exception to their own freshness/trolling rules for this video, nor why their response contradicts the rules as they are written.
http://www.youtube.com/yuusharo - YouTube Channel
http://www.AnimeLosAngeles.org - Anime Los Angeles AMV Events Staff (2008-2012), AMV Competition Coordinator (2015- )
http://www.Anime-Conji.org/ - Anime Conji AMV Events Staff (2013-2015)
http://www.Anime-Expo.org - Anime Expo AMV Events Staff (2015-2018)
http://SakuraCon.org - Sakura-Con AMV Events Staff (2016- )

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DopplerDo
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by DopplerDo » Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:32 pm

Might I suggest a way out of the cathartic shouting into the void?

We know a few things to be true:
  • Bury a Friend is dope -- people really respond to it in audiences and that should make the editor super proud
  • AX, perhaps deservedly, got a rough start with the advent of this thread and that has at least not helped build a bridge between the new coordinators and the editing community
I hope we can look dispassionately at this and recognize that fans at AX really suffer for our indignation if this contest craters and those kids in the audience that would be so inspired by seeing a sweet AMV that they would start editing themselves will just leave saying "meh" instead and completely withdrawing from the contest perhaps feels noble, but isn't a plan that puts the fans first.

If the coordinators respected their own clear rules, leaned into the distrust they've garnered, and did the hard work to reverse the stigma they're saddled with, we'd all be good. Those of us that feel very begrudged the the history at AX can still be begrudged and those of us that don't really have any connection to that get to move on and watch a contest crawl back to life -- and seeing that would honestly be pretty cool.

So first stop on the train ride to a sweet contest that adds positivity to the community is to get the coordinators to keep a level playing field. I think we all agree that's a basic trust thing at the foundation of any contest with freshness rules. There are two simple options: 1) the coordinators pull "bury a friend", or 2) if not, mtagstyle should do other editors a favor and ask to pull the video. The latter sucks, but hey, I've had to pull a video after Maboroshi graciously called me out for breaking freshness rules on accident and it was really no big deal.

If that doesn't work, I will commit to pulling my video from the contest a week from now. If coordinators are waiving the rules to increase quality submissions, then hey, let's take away what they seem to really care about to make a stand instead of ranting here about it. If you're new and just totally pumped about being in the contest, I don't want to pressure you to remove your video -- you do you -- but for anyone who is willing to remove their video, (gets on soapbox) join me on the 25th of June! We shall remove our videos, not for ourselves, but for a specific change that helps others!
GuyFawkesAMV wrote:Remember, remember, the 25th of June
The Freshness Rule Treason and Plot;
I know of no reason why the Freshness Rule
Should ever be forgot.

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XStylus
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by XStylus » Tue Jun 18, 2019 4:26 pm

So... I just received a phone call from one of the folks at AX, and it was a good discussion. Again, the new team are rookies at this, but they very deeply want to get this right and they're feeling super bad about the response so far. They realize the mistake.

Stay tuned, but I think they intend to do right, in whatever way they can. It sounds like their hearts are in the right place, which is what matters most to me.

I also told them to get on the forums here soon as they can.
"Understanding is a three-edged sword: Your side, their side, and the truth." — J. Michael Straczynski

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Yuusharo
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by Yuusharo » Tue Jun 18, 2019 4:56 pm

I appreciate the sentiment DopplerDo, and I understand where you're coming from. I would love to see this event and any AMV Contests out there to remain successful, entertaining, and ultimately give respect to the audience and to the creators. I have no ill will towards AX or anyone over there.

That said, I don't think it is necessary for anyone here to take any action. First off, with so little time left before the convention, I don't think it would be possible for them to pull anyone's video at this point. Between show prep and ballot printing, they're likely locked in with whatever they got.

Both you and mtagstyle are great creators, and Bury a Friend is an awesome video. You both got finalists into Anime Expo. Congratulations! You should enjoy that, sincerely.

I feel the coordinators should recognize their mistake and address it in some way. I think they deserve that chance. Also, they're a new team running with no veterans for a major contest. Mistakes will happen. I made plenty of them my first year coordinating ALA, and the community thankfully gave me time to correct them and to become a better coordinator.

I'm hoping for a positive outcome.
http://www.youtube.com/yuusharo - YouTube Channel
http://www.AnimeLosAngeles.org - Anime Los Angeles AMV Events Staff (2008-2012), AMV Competition Coordinator (2015- )
http://www.Anime-Conji.org/ - Anime Conji AMV Events Staff (2013-2015)
http://www.Anime-Expo.org - Anime Expo AMV Events Staff (2015-2018)
http://SakuraCon.org - Sakura-Con AMV Events Staff (2016- )

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Silent Hero Studios
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by Silent Hero Studios » Tue Jun 18, 2019 5:19 pm

Does anybody know if there will also be a list of the non-finalists?
Silent. Heroic. But never both.

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Rider4Z
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by Rider4Z » Tue Jun 18, 2019 5:24 pm

At the risk of sounding apathetic to the new coordinators and the folks caught in the middle of this fiasco, any attempt to assist in present and future fuck ups will only help leave an unblemished record regarding the amv contest.

The AMV staff at AX quit because AX thinks anyone is replaceable and they(AX) owe no apologies to anyone. They don't deserve our time or our efforts. Not as they are. A failed AMV contest is the only thing I see happening that could actually get their attention. "Oh but the fans..." AX is not and has never been the only place to access AMVs. Fans can and will find them elsewhere, and if they knew how AX treated the AMV staff they'd likely understand and agree AX messed up.
Last edited by Rider4Z on Tue Jul 02, 2019 1:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

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TnAdct1
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by TnAdct1 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:30 pm

Castor Troy wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:30 am
AX is too cool for the rules.
I see the haunted house you're stuck in has WiFi. :wink:

As for my $.02 sense on the current situation, I do feel that this was a simple mistake that rookie contest runners made. In terms of how to handle it, that's a hard choice. As for how to prevent this in the future, either one of two things should happen.

1. Do what Otakon does and have a cut-off date for the anti-trolling rule (after all, it wouldn't be fair for someone to make something in a very short period of time because the entry you want to submit won something shortly before the deadline).

2. Have the freshness rule be based on when the video comes out (i.e no videos made the previous year unless it's a bonus category) while dropping the "anti-troll" rule.

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Silent Hero Studios
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Re: Anime Expo AMV - Farewell & thanks for the memories

Post by Silent Hero Studios » Tue Jun 18, 2019 9:52 pm

Rider4Z wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 5:24 pm
At the risk of sounding apathetic to the new coordinators and the folks caught in the middle of this fiasco, any attempt to assist in present and future fuck ups will only help leave an unblemished record regarding the amv contest.

The AMV staff at AX quit because AX thinks anyone is replaceable and they owe no apologies to anyone. They don't deserve our time or our efforts. Not as they are. A failed AMV contest is the only thing I see happening that could actually get their attention. "Oh but the fans..." AX is not and has never been the only place to access AMVs. Fans can and will find them elsewhere, and if they knew how AX treated the AMV staff they'd likely understand and agree AX messed up.
Wait, you're joking, right? So, then what happens now if there's no staff, and the contest itself?
Silent. Heroic. But never both.

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