Why are dubs automatically given the shaft? (mini-rant)

TaranT · Post by **TaranT** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 1:58 pm

After about ten years of watching anime, I try to be agnostic on the subject of dubs vs subs. Each one needs to be judged on its own. The fact that it's original does not make it the best even if it is the reference.

Japanese companies face the same constraints everyone else does of time, money, and opportunity. A lousy script is not made any better simply because it's in Japanese. Likewise, voice actors may get a role because they're available and cheap, not because they're right for the part.

As for specific titles, I think the Giant Robo dub was far superior to the original Japanese. The Totoro script and acting was also surprisingly good considering the time frame. The crew that dubbed Elf Princess Rane and Shinesman were good. And in fact, a lot depends on the production group and actors, another example being that North Carolina group that dubbed the original YUA OAVs.

Kracus · Post by **Kracus** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 2:09 pm

For me it depends. Sometimes it depends on what version I see first. Simple as that. The majority of the time though the english voice actors don't put the effort japanese voice actors do. All of the dubs version I have though I enjoy cause they are good. Time to time one character might sound stupid, but that's no more then the one or so times a japanese voice actor sounds just as stupid. *shrugs*

As I've come along through, I've caught more and more in sub and didn't or never heard it in dub and didn't care to. Kenshin dub sounds horrible to me. Especially the stupid scenes. I happened to catch the episode were Yahiko is on his own fighting this small band of thieves who were harassing this girl. Now, so many parts in that episode sounded dumb; at one point when the bad guy hit the girl when she tried to stand up to them I burst out laughing cause the audio was so horrible. I didn't like the translation of -kun into little. Kenshin's voice is horrible, and so is Sano and Kaoru. ::takes a deep breath:: I hate that dub and will never willingly watch it.

Old ones I've watched like 8man After, the first release of Akira, GITS and such, I liked dubbed. I loved Batou's voice in GITS. I didn't like the japanese voice cause for that characters look, the american voice fit more to me. I don't care who the director cast cause director's aren't perfect (ie the Brothers who barfed up Reloaded and Revolutions). Then there are ones I don't care. SF and DBZ, I can watch either or. Sometimes I prefer one way over the other, like the yelling in DBZ (for the majority of the time) better, other times its equal. I liked the japanese voice of Akuma in SF Zero than the english voice. And "a warrior must have all his weapons at the ready" sounded better in Japanese than English.

I hate some translations in subs though, they aren't perfect and they often go by too fast for me to read all of it and understand what they are talking about. Example, Eva, Gundam Wing, Gasaraki. Going back to Kenshin, I don't like the Man Slayer. Who in their right mind in the English language say that as opposed to Assassin? Hito - person, kiri -form of kill, translate that crap into assassin assholes. And then to hear it in the dubs,

.
There are two dubs of Akira, I like the first one, the 2nd sounds like crap. Also I hated how they pronouced Kaneda in the 2nd one, it sounded like Canada, the first one was correct to me. Unless I spelled his name wrong and its suppose to be kanada, which then it would sound like it. Whatever.

Anyway, for me it depends.

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 2:18 pm

Kracus wrote:Going back to Kenshin, I don't like the Man Slayer. Who in their right mind in the English language say that as opposed to Assassin? Hito - person, kiri -form of kill, translate that crap into assassin assholes. And then to hear it in the dubs, .

Just to be picky... ;p

Assassin implies that he kills specific people, most likely targetting them because he's paid to (think sniper). Manslayer implies he's someone who kills people. That's all - that he's a killer of humans. Yeah, it sounds really stupid and corny if you hear they calling him a 'manslayer' but the translation is more literal. I think calling him an assassin would have too many implications that just don't hold to his role. Assassin would fit Soujiro killing that guy in the carriage because he was ordered to - it wouldn't really fit someone who kills in a war without going out of his way to assassinate specific targets for some outside motive.

[/end semantic debate]

Either way, I prefer hitokiri to whatever english translation you might come up with. They kept battousai in the english dub (I *think* they did...o.o ) so keeping hitokiri instead of 'manslayer' shouldn't have been too hard. Another reason I prefer the Japanese language - some words are better left untranslated...

Kracus · Post by **Kracus** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 2:29 pm

Arigatomyna wrote:
Kracus wrote:Going back to Kenshin, I don't like the Man Slayer. Who in their right mind in the English language say that as opposed to Assassin? Hito - person, kiri -form of kill, translate that crap into assassin assholes. And then to hear it in the dubs, .
Just to be picky... ;p

Assassin implies that he kills specific people, most likely targetting them because he's paid to (think sniper). Manslayer implies he's someone who kills people. That's all - that he's a killer of humans. Yeah, it sounds really stupid and corny if you hear they calling him a 'manslayer' but the translation is more literal. I think calling him an assassin would have too many implications that just don't hold to his role. Assassin would fit Soujiro killing that guy in the carriage because he was ordered to - it wouldn't really fit someone who kills in a war without going out of his way to assassinate specific targets for some outside motive.

[/end semantic debate]

Either way, I prefer hitokiri to whatever english translation you might come up with. They kept battousai in the english dub (I *think* they did...o.o ) so keeping hitokiri instead of 'manslayer' shouldn't have been too hard. Another reason I prefer the Japanese language - some words are better left untranslated...

I preferred Hitokiri as well. And as it goes for the first OVAs I pegged him as having the position of an Assassin. When he was later just a soilder in the war, then no he wouldn't be called an Assassin, but starting off that's what I pegged his place in the Ishinishin (sp?).

I believe they kept Battousai, and I hated how they said it.

DTJB · Post by **DTJB** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 3:50 pm

Whenever I am given the choice, I usually choose subs, mostly because of the acting quality of the voice actors. That's not to say that I hate dubs, if the acting quality is good, then I'm pleased. But if the acting quality of the dub actors is really bad (actors with no talent, not puting enough emotion into the characters) then I'm usually cringing the entire time I'm watching it.

Usually, when I'm watching an anime DVD, I'll watch it in English first, then in Japanese later. Besides having to sit through the bad acting (if any), this way, I can sit through any large script changes first (Amanda Winn Lee type alterations come to mind), and then see what the show is really worth later.

Moonlight Soldier · Post by **Moonlight Soldier** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 4:20 pm

Given the choice, I'll usually and definately take the subbed version. It may be because I'm vocally conscious of such things, but for the most part, I find the inflections and general emotion better in Japanese. (An example would be Excel Saga for me, I swear the dub voice of Excel never changes her pitch just the volume....it hurts my poor ears.)

The second part being the dialogue. I realize that the whole mouth flap thing is the general reason why dialogue of an uncensored show may be changed, but I prefer the original. I usually find it less corny for one.

Another thing being how the dub voice can change an entire character's personality. A major example of this would be Yuuichiro from Sailor Moon, the dub that I watched for the first 4 years of my anime experience, led me to believe that he was an unintelligent 'surfer' boy type, which turned out to be completely than the original. Even Shinji from Eva was less annoying in Japanese than the English one.

The final thing would probably the whole language concept. I find Japanese to be a beautiful language and I thoroughly enjoy listening to it.

So ya, I usually do check out the dub of my animes....I just tend to prefer the sub. For example, Cardcaptor Sakura....I definately prefer her dubbed voice over the Japanese version...though the uncut dvds don't come with dub tracks so I watch in Japanese with subs. Meh...

P.S I've mentioned this before but....honestly for the most part I despise the english dubs...I don't have a problem with French, or Spanish for example....just something I've noticed over the years....

J-0080 · Post by **J-0080** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 4:31 pm

More often than not I'll watch anime dubbed. I guess many of the voices just sound more familiar to me, and yeah not having to read subtitles. Though also, many of the Japanese VAs sound kinda....funny. They just don't really sound right, their voices not seeming to go with the characters at all.

Plus, some of the guys sound really mean and scary...even when they're not trying to be, on one segement when i had the subs off I thought this one guy was threatening a person (though it turned out he was just saying how much he cared for her

).

the Black Monarch · Post by **the Black Monarch** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 6:58 pm

1) The Eva dub sucks ass, Tiffany Grant is physically painful on my eardrums to listen to, the bitch who did the voice of Ritsuko just can't act, and Amanda Winn Lee completely screwed up everything that she was responsible for (she was responsible for everyone mispronouncing "Eva" in EOE).

2) After watching many episodes of Escaflowne in their original subtitled form, and then watching one episode dubbed, I must say that I'm VERY impressed. If I didn't know any better, I'd think they got a single bilingual cast to do both versions. I also think the Cowboy Bebop dub ain't too bad, either. However, I find the Inu Yasha voice acting very annoying at times, even though I've never even seen it in Japanese.

3) Honk Kong bootleg subtitles suck worse than the very worst dubs.

HeartbreakerByZep · Post by **HeartbreakerByZep** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 7:04 pm

Some people simply don't like to hear english coming out of anime styled characters. That's just a prefference.

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 7:07 pm

HeartbreakerByZep wrote:Some people simply don't like to hear english coming out of anime styled characters. That's just a prefference.

Unless they say english words in the original version - I cracked up at how they had english pronounced in YnM. But I like when they use english names for their attacks in some 'action' anime, just depends on the va and the words...