An analysis of Noir's flaws

EvaXephon · Post by **EvaXephon** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 12:25 am

I recently saw the anime Noir, and I did not like it. I cannot say why. I am sure that if I read a review of Noir that analyzes its flaws, I will understand why I don't like the series. Can anyone here analyze Noir's flaws for me, or point me in the direction of a review that does?

Zalis · Post by **Zalis** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 2:45 am

I liked Noir, but some flaws could be:

Slow, non-engaging pacing

Repetitive/overdone music

Repetitive/budget-saving flashbacks, always incorporating the aforementioned music

Many episodes are killing scenes for random missions not involving the main plot

Realism developed during first two thirds (okay, involving some suspension of disbelief) of the show is seriously thrown into question in the last six or seven episodes

Lack of fanservice (?) (okay, some later episodes have some--not sure if this is a flaw or not)

End of ep 26 Spoiler wrote: Infuriating ending--two final shots in the dark to give us one last slap in the face.

Keeper of Hellfire · Post by **Keeper of Hellfire** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:15 am

Noir is my most favourite anime. It's a polarizing show - love it or hate it.

One reason for this may be that it needs your participation, challenges your phantasy. Many things are only implied, you have to fill it with your own ideas. This was done with intention by the director, and I have to confess, as I watched it the first time I wanted to quit after ep.8 exact for that reason. Fortunatly I continued.

It gives you the possibility to watch the show several times and get a different impression of it every time.

Zalis wrote:Repetitive/overdone music

Not more than in other anime, I'd say it's less. What is different is that the music is that outstanding so that you remark it. In most other anime BGM stays where it is intended to be - in the background. You even don't notice that there is music - if you would do you would figure out that it mostly are variations of a single theme, which is much more repetitive.

Zalis wrote:Repetitive/budget-saving flashbacks, always incorporating the aforementioned music

Not only the flashbacks, some other scenes are repeated too.

But as return for this you have fast paced action scenes and different to many other anime a greater variation of clothing for the main charas, at least at the first part.

Zalis wrote:Many episodes are killing scenes for random missions not involving the main plot

Saying this shows that you got only the half of the show. These episodes show important points in the character development of one of the main charas or shed a light at a special side of them. Many people dislike the show because they miss that point and think it's to slow paced for an action show.

bobbarker31 · Post by **bobbarker31** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 11:14 am

I have seen the first five episodes so far and have not been disappointed. As shows go, the up close and personal body count has been pretty large and they have kept the mystery going.

I am going to stick with it and see how it goes.

EvaXephon · Post by **EvaXephon** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 4:48 pm

Zalis wrote:Slow, non-engaging pacing

Yes! The box set label boasted "Perfect pacing," but I thought that the pacing was too slow. I probably would have thought that the pacing was perfect if it the show wasn't constantly interrupted by...

Zalis wrote:Repetitive/overdone music

...and...

Zalis wrote:Repetitive/budget-saving flashbacks, always incorporating the aforementioned music

You've found the words that I couldn't. That is what aggravated me so much about the show.

Zalis wrote:Many episodes are killing scenes for random missions not involving the main plot

I figured that those were for character development. I actually enjoyed the 'random mission' episodes a little bit more than the others.

Zalis wrote:Realism developed during first two thirds (okay, involving some suspension of disbelief) of the show is seriously thrown into question in the last six or seven episodes

I didn't mind that as much as I minded the pacing, music, and flashbacks. One unrealistic facet was the lack of blood and bullet holes most, of the time. I found myself wondering, "What is the point of guns and so much killing, if there is never going to be any blood and bullet holes? The guns and killing might as well be done away with, then."

Zalis wrote:Lack of fanservice (?) (okay, some later episodes have some--not sure if this is a flaw or not)

I felt that there was only one or two gratuitous fanservice scenes in the entire anime (one in Keeper of Hellfire's avatar, and the other in a bathing scene at the end) and, when watching them, instead of feeling titillated, I actually felt a little bit worried about Noir, hoping that it would be more serious.

As for the ending, I felt that it ended fine. Perhaps that's just compared to some anime. (I would cough into my hand while uttering the name of the anime I'm thinking of, but the list is so long, my throat would be damaged by the time I was done. ^^; )

Keeper of Hellfire was pretty much right about Noir needing your participation. I enjoyed the "Fill-in-the-blank" opportunities it provided, and I always love that as a directorial technique.

As for the music being so outstanding so that you remark it so it seems repetitive every time you hear it, that's a very interesting theory, and I agree with it. However, in Noir, the action often tended to be synchronized with the BGM, and, thus I didn't feel that it stayed "where it is intended to be - in the background."

I disagree that the fast paced action scenes and greater variation of clothing is a 'return' for flashbacks and repeated scenes. Nearly being put to sleep by constant flashbacks, each featuring the same music, is not easily mended by the action scenes (which, I believed, could have been faster), much less a bigger wardrobe.

Knowname · Post by **Knowname** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 11:49 pm

I enjoy Noir, but I guess you have to enjoy the music... of coarse I may be speaking too soon, but, like Crest of the Stars, there's just something about it that screams 'HIT OR MISS!!' Does the thing go downhill as far as the cold blooded killer schtick, after episode 10? Cuz that's as far as I am. I figuree as long as they don't become hippys it'll be all right. It's a little on the overly dramatic side though, but what anime isn't??

EvaXephon · Post by **EvaXephon** » Tue Jun 28, 2005 12:12 am

Knowname wrote:I enjoy Noir, but I guess you have to enjoy the music... of coarse I may be speaking too soon, but, like Crest of the Stars, there's just something about it that screams 'HIT OR MISS!!' Does the thing go downhill as far as the cold blooded killer schtick, after episode 10? Cuz that's as far as I am. I figuree as long as they don't become hippys it'll be all right. It's a little on the overly dramatic side though, but what anime isn't??

I loved Crest of the Stars =D I can see what you mean when you say 'Hit or miss.' The cold blooded killer schtick has its ups and downs; I personally think that the series starts high, quickly goes down low, but then also quickly gets better and better, peaking at the end.

Zalis · Post by **Zalis** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:59 am

Keeper of Hellfire wrote: Saying this shows that you got only the half of the show. These episodes show important points in the character development of one of the main charas or shed a light at a special side of them. Many people dislike the show because they miss that point and think it's to slow paced for an action show.

Yeah, you're right, that was too much of an absolute statement. Again, don't get me wrong--I did like Noir (even bought the thinpak release to replace my bootleg), and I wasn't even bothered by many of the things I pointed out, like the music or slow pacing. However, I was attempting to take a critical view and find things that people in general could find amiss about the show. I'll have to watch it again, now that I have the R1s.

bum · Post by **bum** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 5:52 am

What shits me most about the show is how easy it is to hate the two main characters.(The rambo thing comes a clsoe second). They spend alot of time killing innocent people in an attempt to get to one person. By the time they've got to the guy they've doen more harm in that single eppisode than the suposedly evil person they're killing. If this was some dark adult series with lots of blood and gratigios violence then it would be excusable. However noir tries to pass itself as a mature, adult viewing. Something to be taken seriosly. in that respect it completely fails.

Keeper of Hellfire · Post by **Keeper of Hellfire** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 6:09 am

bum wrote:They spend alot of time killing innocent people in an attempt to get to one person. By the time they've got to the guy they've doen more harm in that single eppisode than the suposedly evil person they're killing.

Huh? Who of the people they killed is innocent? I can't remember at least one of the people killed by Kirika or Mireille being innocent. If you watched it with that negligence, I don't wonder that you hate it. Noir needs your full attention!