selling AMVs?

[paizuri]

Yeah, the thing about the musicians at Fanime...

They were actually playing their instruments there, as in, a live performance. They weren't recording their music, mass producing CDs of them, claiming them as their own original creations, and selling them for money. Any contributions were completely voluntary. It was not payment for services rendered or goods provided. So I think it's a completely different area.

[Drawshot]

Yes, AMVs are made without the license-holders' permissions. But I don't think that factors into the matter.

Well, if you don't factor that into the issue, you will never see the problem. You should not forget that we are dealing with copyrighted materiel. Cutting up and twisting that materiel into an AMV does not remove the copyrights or make the end result yours to do with as you please.

If the copyright holder does not defend their copyright, they lose their copyright. By openly soliciting such materiel, you are running the risk of someone being forced to take legal action. Your statements on stage about having a DVD of your AMVs was not a 'public service announcement', it was an advertisement.

[Anonyma]

I think even the covering cost of CD/DVD is a bit of a grey area. If someone wants to buy a blank CD and get the creator to burn onto it fine.

But when we get into covering the costs of hardware I think it becomes a bit of a no-no. For instance, my most troubled piece of hardware is my '91 Chevy Lumina, at this point it needs new fuel injectors. Could I charge for AMVs to cover that cost? That piece of hardware gets me back and forth from anime conventions, delivers submissions to the appropriate place, lets me shop for anime/music, etc. How different is my car from a modem?

SASE is a good concept, not a single penny of cash is changing hands.

[anneke]

I was at the center of this debate long ago. People thought I was nuts for bringing it up back then...shrugs. Things I learned that I pass on to everyone...

People are going to keep doing exactly as they please.
(Be that selling DVDs/VCDs/Fansubs or not. For profit or not. Etc...).

The only thing that will make people change is actual Legal Action and by then it will be to late for them. <shrugs>

Anneke[/b]

[zenmetsu]

whew. i come back to this thread to find only one (joking) flame. i was worried this thread would get hot. ~_^

i'm glad to see some people thinking along the same lines i was. about legal action: it's not that amvs are any real threat to companies publishing anime in america or the record labels. it's that the fact of money changing hands may force the companies into a situation where they feel they must either defend their copyright or lose it.

about the costs adding up: klinky's right, charging the cost of the media and a sharpie is selling "at cost." all the fancy cases, inserts, whatever, that's just stuff that your ego is telling you to invest in. for that matter, choosing to use dvds instead of cds is just your ego taking over. cost of equipment? you can't write that off as a business expense and expect to be compensated for it. that dvd burner you bought is not just going to be used for making your amv dvds, is it? costs of stuff you lost due to bad wiring? cost of hotel room? why exactly should fans of your amvs be the ones to pay for that? it's a hobby, not a business, and you can't be allowed to make it into one. we all eat the costs of making amvs. all the anime and all the cds we get just for making amvs, the software, the hardware, everything.

i suppose it's no longer a labor of love when you expect compensation for your time. time spent making the cds/dvds as well as time making the amvs.

i don't know why anyone brought up the musicians. they were performing, and the money they recieved was all donations. they weren't selling recordings.

oh, dokidoki, about the adv rep: the difference between those two is in that the one i was quoting was speaking as a representative of the company, not as an anime fan. i'm sure there's a lot of amv fans working at adv, but the company itself can not condone amvs in any official capacity because that would mean giving up their copyright. for all we know, the rep i was speaking of may love amvs on a personal level. but it isn't simple as that when you're speaking for the entire company.

anneke, the idealist in me is telling me to keep discussing this topic in the hopes that people may think twice about doing this. the realist in me knows full well that people do whatever the hell they want, and think they can keep doing whatever the hell they want as long as there's no one to stop them. i have no pity for anyone who may be taken to court for selling a company's copyrighted material in the form of amvs. i do worry, however, that if that happens then the rest of the community may become a target.

[MistyCaldwell]

Bravo, good show

[VicBond007]

So what you're saying is it'd be better for me if my DVD was crap made with Sonic MyDVD, dumped onto a DVDR and labeled with a Sharpie? I'll have you know that quite a few people have already emailed me complimenting me on the professionalism of my DVD, and even though my website is up (where you can download my videos for FREE) I've received so many DVD orders that I've had to order more blanks, even before the current shipment has come in. Am I a threat to the industry? No more than Justin or Brad. If anything, I'm advertising for the anime I've used (AND PAID FOR!!!). I find myself having to refer back to the DDR2 DVD. It's been out for almost 3 months and you wait until MY DVD to post this topic. A professional company selling fan-made AMVs for a hefty price. If that doesn't get industry attention, then I sure as hell aren't gonna cause a stir with MY PRICE. My decission to produce a complex DVD with quality labelling is due to the PRIDE I HAVE IN MY WORK. I set out to design something that would be at home on one's shelf, not propping up their table three days after a con.

[Nappy]

when you give a ride to someone and get gas money do you ask for money for the cost of your car and/or the wear and tear on your car O_O

[ssgwnbtd]

If Vic sees it is his right, nay, his duty to screw those fat cats in the so-called Land of Copyrights, then so be it. Cover the walls with gasoline and mescaline and burn the world to cinders. Let the fury and power of God be upon you the rest of your days and burn you into the deepest of Hells. DVD's are the tool of the anti-satan and shall be cleansed forth from Existence. Amen.

SSGWNBTD
www.animemusicvids.com
"This post does not reflect the policies or opinions of SSGWNBTD."

[VicBond007]

"This post does not reflect the policies or opinions of SSGWNBTD."

Nor mine ^_^() I'm not trying to screw anyone over! Really! I'm a good guy!