selling AMVs?

V3n0m · Post by **V3n0m** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 5:40 pm

I was thinking about this but then when i put my site up i dont know what happened, they said my site was in violation of copyright infringment (See Topic: Copyright Infringment) and yeah, i dont think getting the license agreement with all the record companies, and the Video Providers, is worth it in the long run, i'm thinking about doing that just so my site can get up though since i'm beginning to think my webhost is sucking da pee pee lately, Wonder if i'd need a lawyer for it?

V3n0m · Post by **V3n0m** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 5:47 pm

Drawshot wrote:
TaranT wrote:I don't know why you're giving up. Practically everyone who posted here agrees with you, including me.
I think the reason he is fed up is that despite his very detailed description of what is wrong with selling AMVs, the people's opinions that he would like to change on the matter remain indifferent. The heart of the matter still lies in that Vicbond decided to very visibly advertise that he had his AMVs for sale.

One thing that I don't think Vicbond realizes is that he has turned his hobby into a business. The act of selling your AMVs, whether you are making a profit or not, makes it a business. For example, photography has been a hobby of mine for a long time. Several years ago, I started selling a few of my photographs, and actually got a few freelance assignments. I still can't make enough with my photography to make a living doing it. And, I am still nowhere near even recouping the costs of my equipment. But, I can no longer call it just a hobby. Money has changed hands, so it is a business now.

Many people admire Vicbond, and see him as an example of what they can do. He needs to realize that his actions can affect the entire community. I think we are all safe making AMVs as long as it remains a hobby, and never becomes a business.

It's a hobby for me, yet they rip my website down for a few files then afterwards deny my DN name to me, although i own it for 5 years, til 2008, this was just recently a court in the UK sent my webhost a notice on copyright infringment, after my site being up for no mor ethan a week it was down, then they rip the domain name away from me, after saying "As long as you agree to the terms that you will remove the offending material from your webspace" and yeah, i didnt put shit up on that space for about 2 weeks then i check the domain and it's down, wonder if it's for being idle, but yeah point is i guess it's illegal for me to do my hobby and post it online, *words roll oever and oever in his head" pathetic, wtf, wth,

zenmetsu · Post by **zenmetsu** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 6:01 pm

TaranT wrote:I don't know why you're giving up. Practically everyone who posted here agrees with you, including me.

i'm not so much giving up as becoming frustrated that those selling amvs don't see any danger in it, half the community probably doesn't see any danger in it, and there's nothing to be done to stop it. plus, it's likely that more and more people will start putting their amvs on dvd and selling them, thus increasing the danger that someone'll get fed up with all of us.

Nappy wrote:All they see is there's my work up on the big screen, being used in someone elses work, and now they want to sell it and are advertising to all these ppl at a con I'm supporting hmmmmmm....

nappy, you are GOD. that's exactly it, better than i could ever say it. the danger isn't that we're going to somehow affect a company's bottom line finances, it's that someone's going to be insulted with what we're doing! and depending on who gets insulted, things could change for the worse.

V3n0m wrote:they said my site was in violation of copyright infringment (See Topic: Copyright Infringment) etc

either your webhost is really really concerned about what goes on with their servers, or you were pulling more bandwidth than they wanted you to. in any case, just find another host. the chances of getting permissions from the companies are just about nil. they might give permission before making a video (might want money for use of their stuff, might not), but i don't think they'd ever give permission after you've already used their stuff.

Org Profile · Post by **Phade** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 9:34 pm

Hey All,

Here's what I have to say: Blanks and postage. 'Nuff said...

Phade.

jonmartensen · Post by **jonmartensen** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 9:35 pm

No diggity

Ashton · Post by **Ashton** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 11:56 pm

V3n0m wrote:I was thinking about this but then when i put my site up i dont know what happened, they said my site was in violation of copyright infringment (See Topic: Copyright Infringment) and yeah, i dont think getting the license agreement with all the record companies, and the Video Providers, is worth it in the long run, i'm thinking about doing that just so my site can get up though since i'm beginning to think my webhost is sucking da pee pee lately, Wonder if i'd need a lawyer for it?

Man, about 2 months back I emailed ADV and asked them what they had to say about AMVs and the copyright laws, you know what they said? They said this, "We are transfering your E-mail to the piracy department. Blah blah blah." and that was it. No real info. And then I never heard from them again. I'm pretty sure that the entire anime industry has decided not to touch this one with a ten foot pool, because they are happy with it, and they don't want other legalities to come into play that would ruin their little free advertisement market. I say that what you are trying is impossible, and will be ignored just like my mail.

trythil · Post by **trythil** » Tue Mar 04, 2003 12:04 am

Ashton wrote:I'm pretty sure that the entire anime industry has decided not to touch this one with a ten foot pool

Yeah, because they wouldn't want to drown the issue in legalese.

Ashton · Post by **Ashton** » Tue Mar 04, 2003 1:24 am

trythil wrote:
Ashton wrote:I'm pretty sure that the entire anime industry has decided not to touch this one with a ten foot pool
Yeah, because they wouldn't want to drown the issue in legalese.

Good Call.

SQ · Post by SQ » Wed Mar 05, 2003 1:10 pm

earthcurrent wrote:This is going to be one of those issues that will naturally 'cause a lot of debate amongst various creators. Personally, the attempt to create "professional" level DVDs seems a bit ridiculous to me. Even selling them "at costs" raises a lot of issues, especially if it is being done at cons.

Say you are Otaku Joe, super poor, everyday anime fan,and you've allowed yourself only $30 for your mega anime convention shopping-spree exerience--meaning maybe a single DVD. You head into the dealers room and browse around. Wow, lots of neat stuff, but the prices seem high. Yet, you know that the dealers have to recoup cost for travel, dealer room fees, etc, so you knew that things were going to be a bit expensive. Well, you only have $30 of free spending money, so you decide to give yourself some time to think over what it is you really want to buy.

Now, it so happens that you find out that a AMV creator is handing out DVDs of their works and you come upon them. "Look!" S/he says. "I want people to enjoy my AMVs with the best quality possible so we made special DVDs. I'd love to just hand them out free. But that's not feasible for our wallets, but I'm selling them at cost. I don't make profit on these." Well, you think this is marvelous, you love the AMVs on the DVD and the price is low, so you get a DVD from the creator. While marveling over the professionalism put into the packaging of the DVD, you suddenly realize you don't have enough money to buy any of the items you were looking at in the dealers room. But you rationalize to yourself, the dealers were all over priced anyway, and this AMV DVD was a better bargain.

Now, there is the problem: essentially, by purchasing the AMV DVD, a potential sale was taken away from a legitimate dealer selling merchandise in the dealer's room. The same is true in any situations where a fan product is put into competition for your money--whether at a con, or online.

I'm certainly not out to knock on Vic, he put together his DVD for an honest enough reason, I just don't think that people have thought out the economics very well.

One complaint from a dealer can ban a person or event from a con. I've had expirence with this.

Tim Flanagan is a pencillist who never has a table at Dragon*Con but rather pics a nice spot on the floor near a wall and draws everyone pictures(at a cost of course). Last year at Dragon*Con a dealer complained and this got Tim banned from Dragon*Con. I'm not quite sure for how long, but he's started a petition against it.. But that's a whole different subject..

Anyhow, if a dealer did the same to VicBond(or any other person selling AMVs) then VicBond would not only be banned from whatever Con he was at, but the risk of AMVs as a whole being banned from whichever Con the dealer complained at goes VERY high.

Now, if you were giving away free things, that's a different story. But exchange of money, profit or not, could bring a potential sale from a dealer in the dealer's room.. So really it all boils down to "Just don't do it".

That's from the legal and "I want to go to Cons" point of view... My point of view on this whole matter is as long as you're not gaining profit it's fine by me...

I realize this thread has enough replies, but out of the pages I read(Which I believe was four.. I don't know, I read this a few days a go and haven't replied to it for some reason 0.o) this wasn't said so I felt it should come to attention.

FirestormXIII · Post by **FirestormXIII** » Wed Mar 05, 2003 10:39 pm

jonmartensen wrote:No diggity

No doubt